274, ok now I'm a bit confused

[Amon]

In this chapter it is explained (as far as i got) that there are limited number of gillians who dont loose their personality (egos) when they form and those ones can become Adjucha by eating other Gillians, but thereafter have to eat other Adjucha in order to prevent their devolving back to Gillian and loosing their personality for good.

Whats bugging me is the fact that Shawlong and rest of GJ's hollows that appeared in this chapter looked like Adjucha (except for 1, but ignore him) and Shawlong kinda talked like he is an Adjucha. When they all got killed earlier in the series, Aizen made remark that it doesn't matter since they were all Gillians.
They couldnt have devolved before becoming Arrancar since they since they still had personality intact. Maybe they aren't complete Adjucha in this chapter, but are in development and kinda look like they are (again ignore the big guy), thus got turned into arrancar when they were still in development. Maybe it was just an insult on Aizen's part for them being so weak.

Am I just being stupid and missing something obvious?

P.S. Sorry for any (and all) spelling and grammar mistakes.

[ezxx]

It said to eat other hollows not other adjuchas specifically. It's not really a fact if you believe they look like an adjucha, they were all just closer to that level, shawlong more so than the rest. they were not adjucha just yet.

[DeDaL]

In this chapter it is explained (as far as i got) that there are limited number of gillians who dont loose their personality (egos) when they form and those ones can become Adjucha by eating other Gillians, but thereafter have to eat other Adjucha in order to prevent their devolving back to Gillian and loosing their personality for good.

Whats bugging me is the fact that Shawlong and rest of GJ's hollows that appeared in this chapter looked like Adjucha (except for 1, but ignore him) and Shawlong kinda talked like he is an Adjucha. When they all got killed earlier in the series, Aizen made remark that it doesn't matter since they were all Gillians.
They couldnt have devolved before becoming Arrancar since they since they still had personality intact. Maybe they aren't complete Adjucha in this chapter, but are in development and kinda look like they are (again ignore the big guy), thus got turned into arrancar when they were still in development. Maybe it was just an insult on Aizen's part for them being so weak.

Am I just being stupid and missing something obvious?

P.S. Sorry for any (and all) spelling and grammar mistakes.

Officially you're recognised as an independent and self-consious human at the age of 18. But you don't look and act like an infant the whole time before you actually hit the age milestone, do you? It doesn't go like this: birth - infant - 2year old infant - 5 year old infant - 10 year old infant - 17 year old infant - POOF - 18 year old man. You develop gradually.

These gillans obviously were on their way of becoming an Ajuuca. They too develop gradually. First they become generig Gillan. Then some self-consiousness in that pile emerged and manifested as a different mask. Since that moment the developing had begun, slowly sculpting muscles, mind, abilities...

P.S> Chapter number is 284 by the way.

[Lilium]

I was wondering about that too, but after seeing the explanations by DeDal, i guess that makes sense.

[Sarada]

These gillans obviously were on their way of becoming an Ajuuca. They too develop gradually. First they become generig Gillan. Then some self-consiousness in that pile emerged and manifested as a different mask. Since that moment the developing had begun, slowly sculpting muscles, mind, abilities...

I'm going with Dedal on this.

And didn't they comment on Grimmjow's small size for an Ajuca? So they get smaller and smaller until they come to a point where they can evolve.

It's like a bug shedding his outer skin when it's become too small, but then reversed.

[Velius]

Yea, I am also going to have go with, full ajuchas they were not. Unless Kubo is contridicting himself, this is what makes sense. There maybe some other elaborate explanation, but most of the time the simplest one is the right one.

[Rain]

They weren't adjuchas, or at least not yet, but they were probably getting close. I say they weren't because they were much bigger than GJ (an adjuchas) and they just didn't act like they were (they bowed down to GJ). If they were i'd think they could/would have killed GJ to get closer to becoming Vastolordes.

[Primera Espada]

the only thing that bugs me is the eyes

Grimmjow didn't have hollow eyes. So I took that to mean that is something ajuuca related.

But shadlong didn't have hollow eyes either.

Perhaps he had one hollow eye, and one normal eye?

The only thing I can think of is that shawlong was 95% on his way to being ajuuca, and grimmjow (due to his size) was 90% on his way to being a vastarode.

Remember, if Aizen reserved the first 10 spots for espada (which existed before he started numbering the hollows he made from the hou gyoku) then shawlong was THE FIRST hollow that Aizen arrancarized.

This being said, if Shawlong was the strongest gillian (at the time, since arronieros power can grow rather quickly) it would make sense that he was Aizen's first pic. The rest being strong gillians, almost ajuucas, but not quite.

[Rain]

I think a hollows eyes would be just like the rest of the body. Once a gillians form starts changing (like everyone is Shawlong's group) their eyes may change or may not, just like the rest of their bodies.

Since Grimmjow is the only adjucha we've seen in pure hollow form his eyes may not be adjucha related, it may just be a type of trait menos can have.

[tari101190]

i think shawlong, eduardo and ilforte were adjuchas (or very close to it), while nakim and d-roy were gilian. a gillian is described as being really big and undeveloped, which nakim definetely looks like in the chapter. d-roy does too, but is obviously a bit more developed than nakim. shawlong, eduardo and ilforte fit the adjuchas description as being smaller than gillian. grimmow however seemed quite small which suggests that maybe he was close to becoming vastolorde (like d-roy could just be close to an adjuchas, but not quite there yet). plus ishida said grimmjows team was made of adjuchas and gillian, and shawlong said they do not plan on staying as gillian or adjuchas forever (which suggests between them they were gillian and adjuchas), so my theory should make some sense.

the thing about what ishida said was chapter 242 so you can check yourself. plus kubo wouldn't make him say it if it wasn't true.

in chapter 213 aizen did say they were gillian. then in 242 ishida said they were gillian and adjuchas. what aizen said is true, they were gilian, but that does not mean that each one had to be a gillian. after that ishida said they were gillian and adjuchas so that must've been true too. plus kubo wouldn't have written that if it wasn't true. anyway the chapter showed what shawlong looked like as a gillian before, then says that gillian eveolve to adjuchas, then showed shawlong in a smaller form which is probably to show what he now looks like as an adjuchas. so it makes sense that he is now an adjuchas. a gillian and adjuchas appearence has been explained, shawlong doesn't fit the gillian appearence.

ishida said -
it seems as though the squad that grimmjow brought with him to earth was made up of gillian and adjuchas.

he did not include grimmow in that group, he said that group of gillian and adjuchas came with grimmjow.

anyway now i also think we could guess what some arrancar releases could look like now too, considering what some arrancar's releases have been like after we've seen their original hollow forms too. if you look at the silhouette of an vastolorde, which is obviously ulquiorra, he will probably have that basic shape after he releases. the same with yammy and that adjuchas silhouette and wondwerwice when it showed him before he became an arrancar (so wonderwice should look pretty cool when released). also this is kinda disappointing cos since vastolorde are meant to be very small , human sized, that would mean the vastolorde arrancar would have very small releases compared to other which have been shown. this theory could make sense too cos it wouldn't really make sense for a vastolorde arrancar to have a big release considering that when an arrancar releases they return to their original form (and a vastolorde's original form will be definently small).

but it doesn't matter that much anyway, this is just a theory.

[Amon]

i think shawlong, eduardo and ilforte were adjuchas (or very close to it), while nakim and d-roy were gilian. a gillian is described as being really big and undeveloped, which nakim definetely looks like in the chapter. d-roy does too, but is obviously a bit more developed than nakim. shawlong, eduardo and ilforte fit the adjuchas description as being smaller than gillian. grimmow however seemed quite small which suggests that maybe he was close to becoming vastolorde (like d-roy could just be close to an adjuchas, but not quite there yet). plus ishida said grimmjows team was made of adjuchas and gillian, and shawlong said they do not plan on staying as gillian or adjuchas forever (which suggests between them they were gillian and adjuchas), so my theory should make some sense.

the thing about what ishida said was chapter 242 so you can check yourself. plus kubo wouldn't make him say it if it wasn't true.

in chapter 213 aizen did say they were gillian. then in 242 ishida said they were gillian and adjuchas. what aizen said is true, they were gilian, but that does not mean that each one had to be a gillian. after that ishida said they were gillian and adjuchas so that must've been true too. plus kubo wouldn't have written that if it wasn't true. anyway the chapter showed what shawlong looked like as a gillian before, then says that gillian eveolve to adjuchas, then showed shawlong in a smaller form which is probably to show what he now looks like as an adjuchas. so it makes sense that he is now an adjuchas. a gillian and adjuchas appearence has been explained, shawlong doesn't fit the gillian appearence.

ishida said -


he did not include grimmow in that group, he said that group of gillian and adjuchas came with grimmjow.

anyway now i also think we could guess what some arrancar releases could look like now too, considering what some arrancar's releases have been like after we've seen their original hollow forms too. if you look at the silhouette of an vastolorde, which is obviously ulquiorra, he will probably have that basic shape after he releases. the same with yammy and that adjuchas silhouette and wondwerwice when it showed him before he became an arrancar (so wonderwice should look pretty cool when released). also this is kinda disappointing cos since vastolorde are meant to be very small , human sized, that would mean the vastolorde arrancar would have very small releases compared to other which have been shown. this theory could make sense too cos it wouldn't really make sense for a vastolorde arrancar to have a big release considering that when an arrancar releases they return to their original form (and a vastolorde's original form will be definently small).

but it doesn't matter that much anyway, this is just a theory.

Correct me if im wrong, but as i recall, in Japanese there isn't Singular/Plural difference, but its derived from context. So Ishida could have said that there was an Adjucha and Gilligans (GJ being the only Adjucha), but that could be just a mistake on my part. Could someone (preferably who read original Japanese text) confirm/refute this.

[tari101190]

Correct me if im wrong, but as i recall, in Japanese there isn't Singular/Plural difference, but its derived from context. So Ishida could have said that there was an Adjucha and Gilligans (GJ being the only Adjucha), but that could be just a mistake on my part. Could someone (preferably who read original Japanese text) confirm/refute this.

yeah i know about the singular and plural thing. ajuchas isnt a plural, its just spelt adjuchas, not adjucha i think. anyway it says grimmjows squad was made up of those two. in the sentance he is not described as apart of the squad, cos it says the squad that came with him.

[Saffire]

Adjuchas is indeed singular. Where the conflict begins to arise is that Hitsugaya says that the enemies they fought were all Gillians...

[Amon]

Adjuchas is indeed singular. Where the conflict begins to arise is that Hitsugaya says that the enemies they fought were all Gillians...

But that probably refers to himself, Matsumoto and maybe Renji with Ikaku.

[Saffire]

But that probably refers to himself, Matsumoto and maybe Renji with Ikaku.And who does that leave, from that invasion? I really don't think I want to propose that D. Roy is an Adjucas...

[BigBadBuu]

I guess it's a matter of who'd know better, or who said what with the most certainty.

To me, it seems that Hitsugaya was just making an educated guess as to what level arrancar they were fighting. Ishida's statement, on the otherhand, is/was said with more certainty and had to be based on something he learned from or through his father.

Or then, we've already seen that the line between Gillian and Adjucas is somewhat blurry-- what if they all were not wrong:

Aizen: "they were all gillian", or Adjucas who barely made it past Gillian-level. Also, Aizen would be one to understate losses, no?
Hitsu: "I think they were all only gillian", same as Aizen
Uryuu: "Gillians & Adjucas", true to form, it would be IC for Uryuu to stick to the most accurate definition when describing them

-Buu

[yanniv]

The five that came with Grimmjow were all Gillian. There is no disputing this fact. It's been said already by Aizen and by Ishida now.

[Saffire]

I guess it's a matter of who'd know better, or who said what with the most certainty.

To me, it seems that Hitsugaya was just making an educated guess as to what level arrancar they were fighting. Ishida's statement, on the otherhand, is/was said with more certainty and had to be based on something he learned from or through his father.

Or then, we've already seen that the line between Gillian and Adjucas is somewhat blurry-- what if they all were not wrong:

Aizen: "they were all gillian", or Adjucas who barely made it past Gillian-level. Also, Aizen would be one to understate losses, no?
Hitsu: "I think they were all only gillian", same as Aizen
Uryuu: "Gillians & Adjucas", true to form, it would be IC for Uryuu to stick to the most accurate definition when describing them

-BuuThe catch is that Hitsugaya actually went up against them. Ishida wasn't even near there, occupied besides, and lacking the knowledge of Menos that a Shinigami Captain would probably have. Urahara was an observer in that one as well, so unless he can tell Gillian Arrancar by looking, or Kubo's pulling a retcon, I'd have to stay on Hitsu's side. (I've always wondered if Kubo goofed on that chapter and he really meant Ishida to be referring to the Luppi fiasco...)

The "blurry line" idea is a distinct possibility, since Shawlong at least seemed pretty clever. Though I'm sure that'll set off an argument over which ones were closest to being Adjucas (hint: not Nakim).

[yanniv]

@Saffire Ishida got his information from Urahara. Urahara is considered one of the smartest in Bleach.

[Saffire]

Right, but like I said Urahara wasn't actually involved in that one. On the flip side, we have Aizen, who is definitely in a position to know, and Hitsu's crew, who should be able to tell the difference between an Adjucas and a Gillian by how difficult of an opponent they were. (Really, would any of them be able to stand up to an Adjucas Arrancar? Hitsu was struggling against Yammy, and he's gotta be the strongest of the bunch...)

If we accept the borderline theory, then it makes more sense, but it still seems like Urahara would be overstating their opponents' ability.

[Beee]

I think there could be two possibilities... :

1 - They were Adjucas, but they were much, much weaker than the average one Aizen probably considers them like Gillians

2 - There might be several stages of Gillian-ness? :

1- Menos
2- Distinct Menos
3- Not-menos looking (where the group could be stuck on)

I'd trust the first one better though since I read in a recent chapter something like "we were destined to be only adjucas" ...but who knows... mistranslations happen...
---

I also read here about a theory where hollows grow just like Humans but I don't think the growth of a human is the same than the one of hollows. Hollows seem to evolve more like insects since they have several different forms, while humans keep the same form all the time (proportions change a bit during growth but still).

[Saffire]

I went back to read M7's version of 284, and it looks like Kubo is hinting that at least Shawlong was an Adjucas.

I'm struggling with where Kubo is drawing the line on "Gillian-ness". I'm guessing D.Roy in that flashback was a Gillian, and Nakim obviously was (he still had the black robe), but Ilforte and Edorad were fairly human looking (though very large). I'd be willing to settle with Shawlong being low Adjucas and the other two borderline, so the statements don't really contradict each other.

You know, I just realized...this chapter explains why D.Roy wears that cloth over his head. Grimmjow took a chunk out of him and it never really healed.

[Beee]

hm... good point about the cloth =O it's the exact same spot also...

[wakeskater]

Droy didnt seem that bright anyway

[.access timeco.]

What people keeps forgeting about Ishida statement, is that Grimmjow traveled to Earth TWICE before it.

"The Arrancar with him were Gillian and Adjuchas".
Gillian: First invasion (Gillian Five)
Adjuchas: Second invasion (Luppi, Yammy and, probably, Wanderwice).


But now we know the Gillian Five were Adjuchas Five before (or Adjuchas Four and Nakim)... but they got devoured. I believe the process to extrat them inside Grimmjow, made them turn back into Gillian again.

[Rain]

Since we don't know how long ago these flashbakcs are they may have been adjuchas and reverted back to gillains or something.

It may just sound arrogant but until it is clearly stated (not just partially implied) that they were adjuchas before becoming arrancar I'm going with them being gillians.

[tari101190]

What people keeps forgeting about Ishida statement, is that Grimmjow traveled to Earth TWICE before it.

"The Arrancar with him were Gillian and Adjuchas".
Gillian: First invasion (Gillian Five)
Adjuchas: Second invasion (Luppi, Yammy and, probably, Wanderwice).


But now we know the Gillian Five were Adjuchas Five before (or Adjuchas Four and Nakim)... but they got devoured. I believe the process to extrat them inside Grimmjow, made them turn back into Gillian again.
no, ishidas statement said it seems as though the squad grimmjow brought with him to earth was made up of gillian and adjuchasas in when he came with his own squad. not that second time. that wasn't his squad.

Since we don't know how long ago these flashbakcs are they may have been adjuchas and reverted back to gillains or something.
when they release they goto their originl forms, which looked like they did in thse current chapters. they do not look like gillian at all. the description of what a gillian is has been said anyway. shawlong, ilforte and eduardo do not fit that description, but do fit the description of adjuchas. i doesn't really make that much sense to say they are still gillian. nakim and d-roy do look lik gillian though. plus it even showed how shawlong did look as a gillian too, so why would he have 2 gillian forms.

also now from chapter 284 shawlong says -
from the moment we became hollows
we were meant to be adjuchas
but you were meant to go beyond us
This would mean that shawlong says only grimmjow has the potential to become a vastolorde not them, whilst they were only meant to become adjuchas, which they should be right now otherwise his own statement wouldn't make much sese since they gave up on evolving now anyway so he wouldn' say they're destined to be adjuchas if they weren't already adjuchas.

[twsl]

i agree with tari. if they were really gillian their released body (after the arrancarization) would be stupid and bulky like that arooniro guy (confirmed gillian) at least thats what i think

[.access timeco.]

no, ishidas statement said as in when he came with his own squad. not that second time. that wasn't his squad.
All translation I saw, Ishida said "the ones with Grimmjow", never said "Grimmjow's squad". And, if you think about it, it doesn't make muhc sense, since is very unlikely Urahara knows which Arrancar is part of Grimmjow's fracción and which is not.

[tari101190]

well my chapter actually says squad. and how can you say that about urahara when ishida said he got the info from him. kubo wouldn't write that urahara gave ishida the info if the info was not true. and what you yourself wrote doesn't make much sense itself cos they obviously are apart of his fraccion otherwise why would they have gone with him.

anyway i dont see why anyone is would be looking deeply into the translation anyway. either way it talks abouta group that came with grimmjow. th first invasion of arrancar was a group that came with grimmjow. the second invasion wasn't a group grimmjow brought.

plus the second invasion consisted of only espada. there was obviously no gillian with them (even wonderwice is obviously not a gillian anyway), so ishida/ urahara would not even be refering to that time.

[Shadoblak]

I would think at the very least urahara knows the difference between Gillian and Adjucha class menos........:p

[.access timeco.]

...

read my post again.
Is not because you don't understand something that this something doesn't make sense -__-


EDIT: Ok, since none is understading, I will try to explain... maybe is my bad english

Imagine this slash is Urahara: / - Hello, I'm Urahara

How are you, Urahara?
/ Fine, access, thank you for asking
So, Urahara, tell me. You told Ishida those in Grimmjow's squad were Adjuchas and Gillian?
/ I surely did! And I'm proud of it!
Good. But how do you know who is from his squad?
/ Listen carefully, my fellow: those with him, are from his squad.
No way!
/ WAY!
So, Shawlong, Ilfort...
/ I don't know them by their names
Ok, so the horse face guy, the gay guy, the guy with no orthodontic assistence, the fat mayan and the one with a Shun Shun Rikka on the nose were included?
/ Of course, my horse! Hihihihihi, I'm funny
LOL
/ ...
And the even more gay guy, the retard kid and the brainless gorilla too?
/ They were with him, weren't? So yes
Thank you
/ Whatever...


What I meant is: when Urahara was saying about "Adjuchas and Gillian" he was talking about the guys with Grimmjow on the two times he was on Earth, that includes Luppi, Wonderwice and Yammy.
Even if some translations says he said "the guys from Grimmjow's squad", Urahara doesn't know which, from those 8 Arrancar were and who weren't part of his squad, so he was talking about everyone the same.

[Shadoblak]

...

read my post again.
Is not because you don't understand something that this something doesn't make sense -__-


EDIT: Ok, since none is understading, I will try to explain... maybe is my bad english

Imagine this slash is Urahara: / - Hello, I'm Urahara

How are you, Urahara?
/ Fine, access, thank you for asking
So, Urahara, tell me. You told Ishida those in Grimmjow's squad were Adjuchas and Gillian?
/ I surely did! And I'm proud of it!
Good. But how do you know who is from his squad?
/ Listen carefully, my fellow: those with him, are from his squad.
No way!
/ WAY!
So, Shawlong, Ilfort...
/ I don't know them by their names
Ok, so the horse face guy, the gay guy, the guy with no orthodontic assistence, the fat mayan and the one with a Shun Shun Rikka on the nose were included?
/ Of course, my horse! Hihihihihi, I'm funny
LOL
/ ...
And the even more gay guy, the retard kid and the brainless gorilla too?
/ They were with him, weren't? So yes
Thank you
/ Whatever...


What I meant is: when Urahara was saying about "Adjuchas and Gillian" he was talking about the guys with Grimmjow on the two times he was on Earth, that includes Luppi, Wonderwice and Yammy.
Even if some translations says he said "the guys from Grimmjow's squad", Urahara doesn't know which, from those 8 Arrancar were and who weren't part of his squad, so he was talking about everyone the same.

Its just that, he know everything else :p
And he does seem pretty smart and perceptive....i woul think that he could figure out who was under Grimm's leadership and who was sent there alongside him....But thats just what I think, pay no mind :p

[tari101190]

ok, i doesnt really matter how he knows all this info, but he just does. otherwise if what he said was not true then what would be the point in kubo writing it into the story. kubo put in it cos it was true.

[Rain]

I still think they're gillians- very strong for gillians- but gillians still

-Aizen said they were gillians
-Urahara hinted/said they were gillians (depends on how you take that chapter)
-They themselves said they couldn't become vastolordes, this doesn't mean they are adjuchas

It's a safe bet to call them gillians

[.access timeco.]

I stay with: they are Adjuchas but, somehow, they will degenerate (since Aizen said they were Gillian).

I mean, not only Ilfort said they were at they maximum (that Shawlong stated as "adjuchas"), but D-Roy confidence against Grimmjow, even after realizing he was an Adjuchas, doesn't seems like something a Gillian would have.

[Air]

Shawlong, Ilfort, Edorad -> Adjuca
D-Roy, Nakim -> Gillian

That's what I think the manga is saying.

Given these 2 groups above, we can see:
- Different appearence :
First group are big, but have nearly humanoid shape.
Second ones, are clearly underdeveloped.

- Different death :
The first 3 have been killed by captain level opponents and their Bankai.
The other 2 have been killed by vice-captain level opponents and their Shikai.



And thinking about that, a speculation comes to mind..
Maybe, Gillian-Arrancar don't have a Resurreccion release?
D-Roy and Nakim, were the only ones during the "Night of Sledgehammer" that didn't release..

[Saffire]

And thinking about that, a speculation comes to mind..
Maybe, Gillian-Arrancar don't have a Resurreccion release?
D-Roy and Nakim, were the only ones during the "Night of Sledgehammer" that didn't release..I thought about that, but AaroNiro contradicts that idea.

[Shadoblak]

DeiRoys a moron........(Still my favorite Numero:p)He thought he could eat an adjucha because it was small (Even though that seems to imply he's close to Vastroode) I just think that if Grimm was human sized (Although not human form) And yet not a Vastroode then its possible for very strong Gillians to appear as Adjuchas, even though they arent exactly yet..

[tari101190]

i've kindof changed my opinion a bit now. i think that shawlong, ilforte and edorado were adjuchas at the time of the flashbacks (maybe even d-roy, but nakim was a gillian. however now i think that by the time they all became arrancar they were classed as gillian again because it was stated that if an adjuchas doesn't continue to consume hollows or if their body is injured they will revert back to a gillian. perhaps this only refers to their power level, as in they will still stay in their same adjuchas shapes/bodies, but will be as weak as gillians. this way does make more sense to me now cos they don't even look like gillian so most arguements people did use to say they were gillian don't make much sense if you think about, but this should make sense.

[twsl]

you're forgetting that after they revert they're also supposed to lose their mind by the other hollows taking over

[tari101190]

yeah i guess, but maybe they became arrancar before that was able to happen though.

either way im not abandoning my earlier theory. im saying that they were adjuchas back then for loads of reasons and still have the exact same same bodies now, only diffference is that since they're weaker now they are considered gillian when talkng about power level only, but they still have adjuchas bodies if you get what i mean.

[jelome1989]

I reread few chapters, and I came across this page:

Bleach 213.19

http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/213/19/

Aizen said Grimmjow's fraccion were just Gillians.

hm? i thought they were adjuchas?

[evaric]

"Were" is the key word. It was explained that Adjuchas can regress to Gillians, which one has to assume happened to his Fraccion to keep Aizen's words correct.

[Shdo]

they were on their way to be adjucha, but they knew they cant reach that level, stuck midway.

do you remember when they asked grim to eat them? its because they didnt menaged to advance further, to actually breach the adjucha barrier while grimjow kept on growing.

but there is a weird thing in this statement cuz later they said that arrancar who came from gillian had little to none chance to be in human form (ice ringer and that other guy) yet grimjow group was pretty human like.

[thewizardninja]

@Shdo
No that was while they were adjuchas, the only gillian of Grimmjow's group was Nakim the big guy. It was Vaste Lord that they didn't achieve, not the level of Adjuchas.

@Evaric
I thought about that too but I don't think that was what happened. Remember how in Grimm's flashback we were told all about the idea of regression to a lower level? Well we were told that if one reverts back to a gillian he/she looses their individuality and they become just like the other mindless gillians. Unless a regressed Adjuchas can regain their individuality after arrancarfication, and I doubt Aizen would arrancarify random gillians, then I don't think they returned to being gillians. I think Kubo just made a teensie-weensie error.

[Garrox]

later on there was a little correction ;]

http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/242/09/

"the arrancar that came with grimmjaw were comprised of gillians and ajucas"

[Bekul]

this statement cuz later they said that arrancar who came from gillian had little to none chance to be in human form (ice ringer and that other guy) yet grimjow group was pretty human like.

They weren't very much in human form when Grimjow first met them. The only reason they were in human form later, is because Aizen used the Hogyoku on them, forcing them past the barrier they couldn't pass normally.

[evaric]

@Evaric
I thought about that too but I don't think that was what happened. Remember how in Grimm's flashback we were told all about the idea of regression to a lower level? Well we were told that if one reverts back to a gillian he/she looses their individuality and they become just like the other mindless gillians. Unless a regressed Adjuchas can regain their individuality after arrancarfication, and I doubt Aizen would arrancarify random gillians, then I don't think they returned to being gillians. I think Kubo just made a teensie-weensie error.

Yeah, I remembered the explanation noting that they lost their individuality when reverting but figured Arrancarizing got that back somehow. But it only sounded better in my head, your reasoning makes more sense. :oops

later on there was a little correction ;]

http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/242/09/

"the arrancar that came with grimmjaw were comprised of gillians and ajucas"

Thanks for pointing this out, I had completely forgotten about it. I'll attribute this to KT doing a bit of retconning instead of Aizen being retarded or careless.

[jelome1989]

"
they were on their way to be adjucha, but they knew they cant reach that level, stuck midway.

..."


That's what I first thought too but wizardninja is right, they are already at Adjuchas level but can't progress any further.

[Shdo]

maybe some of them, for example nakim wasnt adjucha, droy wasnt as well.

[Rain]

its not a translation mistake, but more likely, just a change by Kubo

if their gillians were too powerful then there would be no hope for adjuchas and VL fights

so their power was toned down and the levels "reduced"




edit- ahh, this topic has a thread here (http://www.bleachasylum.com/showthread.php?t=709)

[thewizardninja]

maybe some of them, for example nakim wasnt adjucha, droy wasnt as well.

Nakim was gillian but D-Roy wasn't. I can see why you would think D-Roy was gillian but he wasn't, he was just a weak adjuchas.

[Velius]

As Rain pointed out, there is already a thread for this, multiple in fact. Also it's a fan translation, it's not wise to use it to point out mistakes or accuracies.