Legalizing marijuana

[cornflakes]

So.... yeah. Should marijuana be legalised?

I actually have a pretty strong opinion about this, but I'll post my stance/argument later on.

Note: I was actually quite surprised not to find any thread on this topic, I mean, you guys have abortion, gun rights, censorship, religion..... but nothing about this. Just a side-note.

[Rain]

I couldn't care less, I don't smoke pot:D

but i think it should be legalized for a number of reasons.

1) it being legalized will probably make it safer, you're less likely to buy soemthing that was cut/laced with something really dangerous

2) Government regualtion- you know the government would get some tax dollars off it, and if "spending" is something that will help the economy right now, just think about how much all that is spend on pot, that is some serious money.

3) People are going to do it regardless, and if it doesn't endanger them or anyone else then why stop them from enjoying it

[rayne_himura]

we'd have even more brain dead posters on BA and nobody wants that. j/k :lmao

it shouldnt be legalized, if that happens every one would lose their sanity and we'd all plummet back into the abyss. lol legalizing it isn't going to do much for society other than stupify it some more.

[Cara]

If people can smoke cigarettes and drink themselves silly, why aren't they able to smoke pot? I don't really see a difference.

[Rain]

I honestly doubt there are a lot of people who choose to not smoke pot for the sole reason that it is illegal

legalizing it won't make that many more pot smokers, or so i firmly believe

plus, i thinkt here are a num,ber of people who probably do it for the sole reason that it is illegal


the only thing that is a potential problem is that marijuana is a gateway drug, so legalizing that may lead to more people pushing for other drugs to be legalized xD

[earthforge]

I think it should stay illegalized. However, the specifics of the illegalization should be changed. For pot-smokers to get more jail time than wife-beaters and rapists is just stupid. The war on drugs is just as stupid as the "war on terror". Both have gimmic-esque names, but do they do anything? No, they actually serve to instigate a chain of problems.

So, yes, I think pot should be illegalized. But the War on Drugs stuff and cracking down on smokers should be cut down because it only increases the amount of backlash by the industry. Keep it sane by simply cutting back on the obsessive behavior about saying that drug-abusers should spend more time in jail than rapists and wife-beaters. Medical marijuana reasons have no scientific basis in fact, just anecdotal evidence that is insupportable.

[IngenuityGap]

Legalize and restrict it. Make it like alcohol where you have to be 18+, have specific stores for it, and take a vice tax out of every sale. Watch the revenue flow in.

[Shdo]

legalizing it will make more people use it, because it will simply be there.

the drug itself isnt that bad but many people who started with that also degraded to heavier drugs. if you are okay with taking that shit and fucking your body then good for you, i belive in natural selection anyways.

when i was in the army we had one stonehead and it confirmed to me all the stereotypes. on a side note i dont respect people who smoke either, there is something in people who take drugs and smokes that ticks me off, anykind of addiction to a meterial is sick in my eyes. unless you actually need that thing from the start to live\function, like many legalized drugs, then i already have a lower opinion on you.

[IngenuityGap]

legalizing it will make more people use it, because it will simply be there.

Actually, in the Netherlands general use has gone down since they loosened the laws. For some people there is a mystique of something being forbidden making it more appealing. Those people will go on to harder drugs anyway.

the drug itself isnt that bad but many people who started with that also degraded to heavier drugs. if you are okay with taking that shit and fucking your body then good for you, i belive in natural selection anyways.

That's more of a personality thing than anything else. I'm a regular smoker and have never tried anything harder nor do I have any inclination to. There are a large segment of marijuana users that have educated themselves [both to the positives and negatives, as well as side effects and addiction potential] on other drugs through research and discussion.

It doesn't take a lot of looking to realise that, of the drugs most regularly used, a lot of them are dirty. Cleaning chemicals and poisons used to cut or even produce them. It's a crap shoot that never, ever turns out well. Marijuana is not one of these since it is grown and not manufactured.


when i was in the army we had one stonehead and it confirmed to me all the stereotypes. on a side note i dont respect people who smoke either, there is something in people who take drugs and smokes that ticks me off, anykind of addiction to a meterial is sick in my eyes. unless you actually need that thing from the start to live\function, like many legalized drugs, then i already have a lower opinion on you.

As with any group, there is always a small segment that is completely stupid and ruins it for everyone else. This is the stereotypical stoner. 90% of smokers don't act like that, don't want to act like that, and try to put as much distance between themselves and people who act like that as possible.


I can understand having that view and possibly where it comes from, but I certainly can't agree. Fortunately, I don't see that as an impediment.

[Spartan27]

It should be legalized, the drug itself isn't as dangerous as alcohol, I mean you've never heard of anyone ODing on Pot, you do hear people killing themselves on alcohol. The idea that more people will use it is a myth, anything that is taboo will be used more, because it's seen as being something that is forbidden.

Shdo if you really think that all smokers are alike based upon one person then I feel sorry for you, the stereotypical pothead is just not true in many cases, I know tons of people who smoke the stuff, people that smoke it more than me, and they are not the people that you might think they are.

There should be restrictions of course, but to have alcohol be legal while restricting the use of marijuana just seems like a huge hypocritical stance to me.

[Shdo]

something that works in the netherlands wont necessery work in another country. nothing does.


and still i dont respect this choice of taking drugs, no excuses in this thing, especially when this drug have a much lower addiction rate then others(which make it more of a choice then an addiction) so whatever sympathy i have is pretty much gone.

[IngenuityGap]

something that works in the netherlands wont necessery work in another country. nothing does.


and still i dont respect this choice of taking drugs, no excuses in this thing, especially when this drug have a much lower addiction rate then others(which make it more of a choice then an addiction) so whatever sympathy i have is pretty much gone.

The point being that the only location that has moved to loosen the drug laws to that extent has seen a decrease in use. If there were other examples to point to, I certainly would.


Sympathy isn't being called for. As I said, I understand you view, but can't agree with it. Doesn't change my opinion of you though.

[Rain]

I think it should stay illegalized. However, the specifics of the illegalization should be changed. For pot-smokers to get more jail time than wife-beaters and rapists is just stupid. The war on drugs is just as stupid as the "war on terror". Both have gimmic-esque names, but do they do anything? No, they actually serve to instigate a chain of problems

I agree with this at the very least. Even if it must/does remain illegal, the penalities for use are too severe where comapred to make more "crimal" actions.

So, yes, I think pot should be illegalized. But the War on Drugs stuff and cracking down on smokers should be cut down because it only increases the amount of backlash by the industry. Keep it sane by simply cutting back on the obsessive behavior about saying that drug-abusers should spend more time in jail than rapists and wife-beaters. Medical marijuana reasons have no scientific basis in fact, just anecdotal evidence that is insupportable.

I wouldn't say that it has no basis, but rather that what it really does is often misconstrued. all medical marijuana does for glaucoma for example is remove pressure off the eye, and it reduces the pain/stress (or makes the person stop caring/noticing whats going on). Many think/expect it to heal it, or at least act as a preventitive, but it doesn't

But i do think that if there are any reasons for the legalization of marijuana, this should be on the bottom of the list:D

[Spartan27]

Shdo I have a question for you, do you lose any respect for those that choose to drink alcohol? If you do lose respect for those people then that's fine and I totally respect that view, if you don't then you're a hypocrite.

[Shdo]

you mean alchoolists? i dont respect them. whenever you take any substance regulary to the point of addiction without an actual need for it (like some drugs) then i cant respect that. people who drink only to drown their sorrow are patethic, smokers who waste so much money every month on their poisen are pathetic, any kind of addiction is pathetic.

[Spartan27]

I would agree with you that addicts are a sad lot, you see this is a position that I can agree with, anyone that becomes addicted to something has some problems that they need to sort out.

What I'm saying is that you can smoke weed in moderation without becoming addicted to it, just as you can drink without becoming addicted to alcohol.

[Shdo]

i doubt that but again, since i do belive in free choice i dont mind if millions of people choose to take the path to more heavier drugs. but i dont really see the point in putting smoke into your launges again and again and again.


the problem with legalizing them is that it makes them more at hand to those who couldnt have got them before. sure you can say that people would still smoke them but the same can be said on any other crime, just because its illigel that dosnt mean people wont do it.
if, for example, murder was legal, would that increase or decrease murder?

since legelazing marijuhana wont decrease its use (look at cigarates, millions of user) the only question here is if the drug is even a threat.


in the case of cigarates i think it should be outlawed, it weird to me that we allow our people to fill their launges with this tar.
drinking on the other hand, kill when mixed with driving and in casses of exessive drinking i blame those who actually allowed the drinker to drink this much for so many years.

[Rain]

the problem with legalizing them is that it makes them more at hand to those who couldnt have got them before. sure you can say that people would still smoke them but the same can be said on any other crime, just because its illigel that dosnt mean people wont do it.
if, for example, murder was legal, would that increase or decrease murder?

since legelazing marijuhana wont decrease its use (look at cigarates, millions of user) the only question here is if the drug is even a threat

this is where we differ, it being legalized won't necesarily increase the number of users (maybe 1 time users, but i doubt perpetual users will change)

because it isn't hard to get it now, if people are interested at all right now, they probably get it

I don't know anyone who says "man i wish i could just try pot once, but its illegal and too hard to get"

if people want it, even just to try once, they get it

[Shdo]

at the current situation, those who want to try are either afraid of the legal aspect or they dont know anyone who sells (if everyone knew those who sell then the cops would know as well and bust everyone)

once it legalized then those two problems are gone, you got thousends more who join the group, those who were afraid before dont need to and those who couldnt find a seller will find one at ease since the seller isnt afraid to declare he sell it.


again, if you made murder or rape legal you would see increase of it and not a decrease. the same goes with anything else, if you would make cigarates and alchool illigel then you will see a decrease.

and ofcourse that people will break the law, they always do but if there wasnt a law at all then they would do it more, no matter what law it is.

so the question is if marijuhana is dangerous or not and not if it will decrese if legalized.

[Rain]

at the current situation, those who want to try are either afraid of the legal aspect or they dont know anyone who sells (if everyone knew those who sell then the cops would know as well and bust everyone)

once it legalized then those two problems are gone, you got thousends more who join the group, those who were afraid before dont need to and those who couldnt find a seller will find one at ease since the seller isnt afraid to declare he sell it.


again, if you made murder or rape legal you would see increase of it and not a decrease. the same goes with anything else, if you would make cigarates and alchool illigel then you will see a decrease.

and ofcourse that people will break the law, they always do but if there wasnt a law at all then they would do it more, no matter what law it is.

so the question is if marijuhana is dangerous or not and not if it will decrese if legalized.

what about prohibition

back when that was attempted in the 1920's the amount of drinkers, alchol consumed went up, pretty much because it was illegal


but since we dont agree on this point we should move on

even if the numbers do go up, it is still a persons choice, if it is legalized it will be made safer, and it could help the economy

[kiera2]

It should be legalized, the drug itself isn't as dangerous as alcohol, I mean you've never heard of anyone ODing on Pot, you do hear people killing themselves on alcohol.
I've heard of plenty of drivers who have been killed or killed others while under the influence of marijuana. And my friend's cousin is hospitalised for life after marijuana use trigged an extreme case of schizophrenia in him. Marijuana has been known to trigger psychiatric illnesses - which is why I'll personally never try it, with my family's mental health history. Just not worth the risk.

Personally I think it should stay illegal.

you mean alchoolists? i dont respect them. whenever you take any substance regulary to the point of addiction without an actual need for it (like some drugs) then i cant respect that.
Do you have any idea whatsoever about what physical addiction is? Alcoholics aren't alcoholics because they drink too much. They drink too much because they're alcoholics. And they're alcoholics because of a genetic predisposition to addiction to that specific substance. If you'd ever known an alcoholic struggling to fight their addiction you'd understand that they deserve pity, not contempt.

[IngenuityGap]

I've heard of plenty of drivers who have been killed or killed others while under the influence of marijuana. And my friend's cousin is hospitalised for life after marijuana use trigged an extreme case of schizophrenia in him. Marijuana has been known to trigger psychiatric illnesses - which is why I'll personally never try it, with my family's mental health history. Just not worth the risk.

What was being discussed was the lack of deaths by overdose. It is literally impossible to do so. As for driving while intoxicated, it's a terrible idea no matter what substance. However by it's nature marijuana is going to make you drive slower and be much more cautious. The cases of marijuana being involved with an accident usually involve one or more other drugs.


The chance of marijuana use combining with the right factors to trigger an extreme case of schizophrenia is incredibly rare. Possible, yes, but rare. Not to discredit your anecdote, but there are a ton of "my friend's friend" or "my friend's relative" stories out there. If all were true you'd see a much higher rate of hospitalization.



Basically, anecdotes aren't worth anything when compared to hard data.

[Spartan27]

I've heard of plenty of drivers who have been killed or killed others while under the influence of marijuana. And my friend's cousin is hospitalised for life after marijuana use trigged an extreme case of schizophrenia in him. Marijuana has been known to trigger psychiatric illnesses - which is why I'll personally never try it, with my family's mental health history. Just not worth the risk.

Personally I think it should stay illegal.


Do you have any idea whatsoever about what physical addiction is? Alcoholics aren't alcoholics because they drink too much. They drink too much because they're alcoholics. And they're alcoholics because of a genetic predisposition to addiction to that specific substance. If you'd ever known an alcoholic struggling to fight their addiction you'd understand that they deserve pity, not contempt.

I think I need to clarify my earlier statements, one I never talked about the influences that marijuana can have on the mind, I was talking about the fact that you can't OD on the stuff, now as for what it does to the mind such as driving that's an issue where it would be illegal to drive under the influence, you can't drive under the influence of prescription drugs, so it's basically the same thing.

As for Alcohol addiction, I made a statement that was not really how I wanted to put things, Alcoholics in general need help, they need to be treated, it's not something that we as people should hold against others, we need to help them get over it. There's a reason why we as a civilization have made centers that help people in need of assistance.


The thing is that Alcohol in general is a lot more dangerous than Marijuana yet it's the vice that is legal, this just seems to be a hypocritical stance to take.

[kiera2]

What was being discussed was the lack of deaths by overdose.
Sorry, I thought you were comparing it to alcohol-related deaths?

As for my friend's cousin, this isn't just some random friend - it's a girl I lived with for three years at university and am very close to. It's something she doesn't like to talk about because it really upsets her, but I can promise you this isn't some fifth-hand cock and bull story.

The negative effects that marijuana can have on those genetically susceptible to mental illness is something that we covered in psychopathology lectures at university. Unfortunately all my notes from that subject are back in Australia so I can't link you to the hard facts, but I can assure you there is evidence of increased rates of depression, anxiety, and suicidal thinking in chronic marijuana users. I know that as a first degree relative of a bipolar sufferer it would be a bloody stupid idea for me to use marijuana. And I know also that there are plenty of people out there who aren't aware that they're at risk for similar reasons.

[Shdo]

many of the alchoolics do that to escape their reality, its this escape that i dont accept. that initial run downhill that was done by their own will.people poisen themselves willingly.

[cornflakes]

Whoa, looks like I've opened up quite a can of weed, uh, worms here. Varied range of opinions and interesting arguments, guys.

and still i dont respect this choice of taking drugs, no excuses in this thing, especially when this drug have a much lower addiction rate then others(which make it more of a choice then an addiction) so whatever sympathy i have is pretty much gone.
Can I ask you something? (Actually I'm going to assume I can, lol) Do you drink coffee, maybe to perk you up sometimes? Or went on a sugar binge when you're depressed? They both alter states of mind, like cannabis. Therefore, Nescafe and Hostess cakes should be criminalised. :cookie

Reading your posts in this thread, IMHO you're confusing moderate use with addiction. The people I know of who smoke pot (including me) do that something like once a couple of months, sometimes not even then. The rest of the time we're sane, productive members of societies. That's a far cry from a stereotypical stoner, much like how a guy who enjoys a few beers with his friends over a game of football once a fortnight differs from a guy who's drunk before noon every day.



http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/mr_cereal/drug_graph.png
Take a close look at this graph. Note the positions of tobacco and alcohol, and then note that of cannabis. If you can't find it, it's considerably to the left and bottom of both tobacco and alcohol, meaning weed is both less dangerous and less addictive than them.

So if marijuana is less harmful than tobacco and alcohol, why is it criminalised but not tobacco and alcohol? The only disadvantage is that weed is not socially sanctioned while cigarettes and alcohol is. Spartan27 has mentioned this, but I feel the glaring hypocrisy is impossible to overstate.


I don't know anyone who says "man i wish i could just try pot once, but its illegal and too hard to get"
I was like that once, I don't see why that's so hard to imagine. I would have continued not ever smoking pot had I not made some friends do had contacts for this kind of stuff.

But I disagree with the gateway drug hypothesis. I think people who do 'soft' drugs like marijuana are divided into two types. One's blokes like me who like the experience of a weed high, but know the limitations-- I won't try anything beyond marijuana because of the health risks involved, and I won't try smoking too much weed so as to endanger my health. The other type is the envelop-pusher: the type who does some things on the fringe of taboo just because he can, and half for the thrill of the illicit. This kind of guy will try hardcore drugs sooner or later, regardless of gateway drugs such as weed or alcohol.

To put it simply, it's the person, not the drug. Do you ban alcohol because drunk driving is a leading cause of road accidents? No, you educate the public on drinking responsibly ("Don't drink and drive" and all that jazz). How is that different from weed?

[Shdo]

true, and on the coffe thing, i find it a disgusting habit as well.
i hate its taste and again during my militery service i saw people who simply couldnt even move without coffe, when you need something to even start the day then you got a problem.

so no, i dont drink coffe beside something like three times in my life which was an attempt to boost my preformance before a major test, didnt helped either.
on a side note i usually wake up already pumpout unlike other people but i think that their dependance on coffe contributed to their morning weakness.
anykind of addiction is bad.

[kiera2]

that initial run downhill that was done by their own will.people poisen themselves willingly.
It doesn't work like that. People who have drunk far less than I have have found out the hard way that they're alcoholics. Some people can drink as much as they like without becoming dependent. Others start drinking once and can't stop.

[Rain]

cornflakes- i agree with your post (even the gateway drug thing, i dont personally know about it, its all in what ive heard)


Shdo- some people just aren't morning people, they can't function well immediately after waking up

i wouldn't be so quick to say an addiction is bad, but thats just me

kiera- your are correct that marijuana can effect a persons mental status severely, especially if there are pre-existing onditions or a family predisposition

but i dont think that it should be outlawed because of that. Many of these people either take it now, or have a chance to take it now, its legalization won't be the factor that says, ill take it

and if it is legalized those same people will be more likely to get help

If a person is thinking abiout suicide after smoking some pot, what are the odds they will call for help. if its found out they have been smoking then will get penalized. But if it was legal, there is more of a chance that they can get the help they need

[cornflakes]

If a person is thinking abiout suicide after smoking some pot, what are the odds they will call for help. if its found out they have been smoking then will get penalized. But if it was legal, there is more of a chance that they can get the help they need
An irreverent post here, if you are still thinking of suicide after smoking weed, then you must be really choked up about whatever's making you choked up. xD

Sorry, just couldn't resist. (It is one in the morning......) I promise I'll be more serious tomorrow.

[Tatsuki]

Legalize it and tax the hell out of it! :D

That's my view on just about every vice. We already have legalized gambling (The lottery) to support education, poor nicotine addicts support most of the budget, and for some reason, the comparable taxes on alcohol are low, but it should go up.

On a related note, it should at least be available for medical purposes in every state. It can be very beneficial medically, and I don't know the research, but is it more dangerous than Klonopin or Xanax, or other anti-anxiety medication?

Anti-depressants and anti-anxiety drugs are made from all sorts of chemicals, and marijuana seems safer by comparison in my layman's mind, just because it grows naturally and has been used for years by tons of people without too much ill effect.

*Disclaimer* I have never used marijuana. Ever.

[Ann-chan]

lol marijuana is legalised here xD since ages ago :lmao

I have used it but like only once to try, I don't care for it and don't use it otherwise. I know some people who use it more regularly but not more than once a week or two weeks or whatever. The only problems we ever have with marijuana is those damn tourists in amsterdam who have no clue how to use it and what is safe or not and then throw themselves off a bridge cos they used something way too strong for 1st time >__>;

also, a while ago we had this broad research into what cannabis does to the brain and turned out it really isn't any worse than alocohol or cigs or whatever >__>;

so yeh, I dunno why it shouldn't be legalised xD only if you know a country will rampage it and all become addicts I'd say leave it, but if people handle it responsibly it really isn't a big deal :T not like everyone always stoned here either lol it's frowned upon still even though legal so it's really a very small part of the country that actually does it on a regular basis.

[neoleonhart]

I like my neurons so i voted no.

lol marijuana is legalised here xD since ages ago :lmao

I have used it but like only once to try, I don't care for it and don't use it otherwise. I know some people who use it more regularly but not more than once a week or two weeks or whatever. The only problems we ever have with marijuana is those damn tourists in amsterdam who have no clue how to use it and what is safe or not and then throw themselves off a bridge cos they used something way too strong for 1st time >__>;

also, a while ago we had this broad research into what cannabis does to the brain and turned out it really isn't any worse than alocohol or cigs or whatever >__>;

so yeh, I dunno why it shouldn't be legalised xD only if you know a country will rampage it and all become addicts I'd say leave it, but if people handle it responsibly it really isn't a big deal :T not like everyone always stoned here either lol it's frowned upon still even though legal so it's really a very small part of the country that actually does it on a regular basis.

Oh and in Holland it's not legalised it's use is just tolerated; "gedoogd" as the dutch say

[Poiison]

i believe legalizing but restricting should be enforced 8D
like stated earlier.

it could be used as a drug, both in the negative and 'positive' sense.

okay~
well by human nature, or as far as i have seen, some people do things for that are illegal or 'wrong' solely because it is forbidden or whatever other synonym you wanna tape onto it.
something about the human is that it wants to do things that they are told not too, i mean there are exceptions but this is also another big reason.
which to me means by legalizing it the hype should go down by a bit, but as i said restricting it should also help. So you should be able to turn the numbers down by some portion by legalizing it.

i'm not into pot or drugs or whatever, so i'm not very big on this topic but i do have my opinions.

and alcohol and cigarettes are also like this.
if they banned marijuana why not do the same for alcohol and cigarettes?
since both of those items are legalized but restricted they should do the same as marijuana.

i mean ridding the country of all these things would be like super, but that's definitely not gonna happen.

so my stand is on legalizing but restricting marijuana as well.

[Ann-chan]

@neoleonhart: nope, it's legal, but it's a little complicated. The use and selling to the public is legal, but the growing isn't xD it's really weird, cos you can't grow it and sell it to a coffeeshop, but if the coffeeshop sells it it's ok xD

[ralphy-sama]

I wish pot were legal. When i just wanna zone out, watch 10 episodes of Bleach, and forget i had my hand in a Dorito bag for an hour while giggling at notions that aren't funny. I turn to my weed.

[abducted]

I just took a drug test last week to get a job, (the procedure btw feels really humiliating and demeaning even tho its justifaible because ppl do cheat) and was thinking its crazy that an employer could pass on someone if they fail a drug test (at least for THC) and yet hire someone thats borderline alcoholic and with alcohol even if ur not drunk the next day, the hangover can still really affect your performance level.:rolleyes: