Abortion discussion

[Otome-san]

Here is the place for you to post facts and statistics that support your opinions on abortion.

Remember to post with courtesy.

[Amami]

In my opinion killing your own child because of your own life mistake is wrong. I'm strongly against abortion.

I cannot imagine a woman doing this because she's too young for being pregnant and it may ruin her life. I mean, she should have known what consequences of sex life may bring. She should bear consequences or give birth to a child and give it to adoption. There are so many childless coupless who would love to give their love to such a child.

Another issue is abortion because a child is sick. There are so many sick, handicapped and disabled children and they live. And they teach each and every one of us that you don't need to be perfect to be loved nor to love anyone. Most importantly they teach others that God's love is unlimited. It doesn't mean that they all suffer. Some do suffer a lot. But it doesn't mean that a woman may be allowed to play God and kill an unborn child.

I know the most shocking issue is about a pregnancy as the result of rape. I can only guess what it feels like to carry a child of a man who hurt a woman so severly. However, I think, it doesn't change the fact that killing an unborn child is like playing God.

Imagine that an unborn child could be a person who in the future could bring peace, change the world, contribute largely to our world. And a woman decides to go for abortion just like that because of egoistic reasons.

I'm a religious person and I think nobody has a right to act as God. It's not humane to make abortion, whether for a woman or for a doctor making it. Applies to both sides. A woman decides and makes it, still kills a life that has a purpose. And a doctor commits a crime, makes abortion and kills a life that has a purpose. Now, doctor should help people and treat them, cure illnesses. Since when abortion is an illness?

It makes me sad to think that every unborn child (aborted pregnancy) was sent into a woman's womb with a soul and with a purpose to fulfill on this planet and a mere human is able to get rid of a life as if it was a trash. :(

Thou shalt not kill.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that all the unborn children are not guilty! Then killing them is a nonesense.

[B. Haddrell]

@ Amami

I very much respect your viewpoint on abortion but my opinion is, absolute laws or regulations can never be just. Therefore I am very much pro-choice within the limits of the law.

I am sure, only a tiny minority of women who decide to have an abortion made this choice lightly. Before I continue, let me tell you that I am probably the oldest member here, I am married with a 10-year-old daughter and I am disabled.

It is kind of interesting that you are talking about the duty, the moral obligation of a woman to keep her baby no matter what the circumstances but the father is not even mentioned once here.

And what is playing God? If you mean deciding about life and death, interfering who survives and who doesn`t – we humans have increased our natural life spans in “unnatural” ways all the time. New life is also created sometimes in such ways. This argument has no weight at all because God gave us humans a brain and we are supposed to use it. We were supposedly created in God`s image and our intelligence has been given to us as a means to grow, to become wiser, to learn, to stretch our minds to new limits and maybe beyond. This includes morality as well. Moral values have changed a lot and they will continue to change.

A baby is precious. I very much agree with that. I consider my daughter to be a late, extremely valuable gift. But also because I want the best for her, I would have thought long and hard if I would abort her if I had learned that she would be born with a serious birth defect especially when it is affecting her mind.

And being a mother, I also have to be egoistic. I have to look after myself as well also because my child needs me. This would also include the question: How would I cope with looking after a severely disabled child that would need care 24 hours a day on top of looking after other siblings who need me as well? Maybe I would be even forced to do so on my own because the father doesn`t want to handle the strain any more, insists on a divorce and disappears?

[S41kop4thy]

In my opinion killing your own child because of your own life mistake is wrong. I'm strongly against abortion.
It may sound harsh, cold and nihilistic, but I don't think an unborn fetus is a child... If that were the case, then every sperm cell/ovary would be a potential child and every man and woman in the world would be a mass murderer... To me, unless a child is actually out of the womb, it's nothing more than cells and tissue, like hair or an organ...

I cannot imagine a woman doing this because she's too young for being pregnant and it may ruin her life. I mean, she should have known what consequences of sex life may bring. She should bear consequences or give birth to a child and give it to adoption. There are so many childless coupless who would love to give their love to such a child.
The fact that a woman was ignorant enough to have unprotected sex doesn't mean that she doesn't have the right to control the birth of a parasitic organism within her body... As far as adoption is concerned, abortion is much simpler, although more expensive...

Another issue is abortion because a child is sick. There are so many sick, handicapped and disabled children and they live. And they teach each and every one of us that you don't need to be perfect to be loved nor to love anyone. Most importantly they teach others that God's love is unlimited. It doesn't mean that they all suffer. Some do suffer a lot. But it doesn't mean that a woman may be allowed to play God and kill an unborn child.
Really? To me there is no greater crime than sentencing your kid to a ugly existence. Note that I didn't say miserable, I said ugly. A person might be happy, but still living a poor life. Or they might be happy, but hurt others. A serial killer lives a "happy" life, enjoying his every kill, but that doesn't mean he's not human garbage. And even if his parents aren't responsible for his actions, they are responsible for his existence and upbringing... Of course I'm not saying that people should refrain from having kids because they might turn out bad, but they should consider the life they might offer their children before giving birth to them, especially in case their child is going to be born sick.

I know the most shocking issue is about a pregnancy as the result of rape. I can only guess what it feels like to carry a child of a man who hurt a woman so severly. However, I think, it doesn't change the fact that killing an unborn child is like playing God.

I'm a religious person and I think nobody has a right to act as God.

Everyone is a god of their own body.

Imagine that an unborn child could be a person who in the future could bring peace, change the world, contribute largely to our world. And a woman decides to go for abortion just like that because of egoistic reasons.

There's an equal chance he/she might turn out to be Hitler.

A woman decides and makes it, still kills a life that has a purpose. And a doctor commits a crime, makes abortion and kills a life that has a purpose.
I think only conscious people give their lives a purpose.

Now, doctor should help people and treat them, cure illnesses. Since when abortion is an illness?
It's a surgery. That's where doctors come in.

It makes me sad to think that every unborn child (aborted pregnancy) was sent into a woman's womb with a soul and with a purpose to fulfill on this planet and a mere human is able to get rid of a life as if it was a trash.
I accept your beliefs but I'm not religious so the term soul doesn't mean anything to me.

Thou shalt not kill.
EDIT: I forgot to mention that all the unborn children are not guilty! Then killing them is a nonesense.

There are innocent herbivorous animals that get eaten by carnivorous ones every day. Life is harsh.

And what is playing God? If you mean deciding about life and death, interfering who survives and who doesn`t – we humans have increased our natural life spans in “unnatural” ways all the time. New life is also created sometimes in such ways. This argument has no weight at all because God gave us humans a brain and we are supposed to use it. We were supposedly created in God`s image and our intelligence has been given to us as a means to grow, to become wiser, to learn, to stretch our minds to new limits and maybe beyond. This includes morality as well. Moral values have changed a lot and they will continue to change.
+1

And being a mother, I also have to be egoistic. I have to look after myself as well also because my child needs me. This would also include the question: How would I cope with looking after a severely disabled child that would need care 24 hours a day on top of looking after other siblings who need me as well? Maybe I would be even forced to do so on my own because the father doesn`t want to handle the strain any more, insists on a divorce and disappears?
Also, would it be right to bring a child into this world knowing that it would be cursed to live a 10 times more difficult life than others from his very first breath?

[Amami]

It is kind of interesting that you are talking about the duty, the moral obligation of a woman to keep her baby no matter what the circumstances but the father is not even mentioned once here.

I didn't mention the father because I think the main decision belongs to the woman. It's her womb.


And what is playing God? If you mean deciding about life and death, interfering who survives and who doesn`t – we humans have increased our natural life spans in “unnatural” ways all the time. New life is also created sometimes in such ways. This argument has no weight at all because God gave us humans a brain and we are supposed to use it. We were supposedly created in God`s image and our intelligence has been given to us as a means to grow, to become wiser, to learn, to stretch our minds to new limits and maybe beyond. This includes morality as well. Moral values have changed a lot and they will continue to change.


I agree with you. I think playing God is deciding who lives and who dies. By saying this I mean deciding which child should have the right to live and which doesn't. Who we are to decide whether to make abortion or not.


And being a mother, I also have to be egoistic. I have to look after myself as well also because my child needs me. This would also include the question: How would I cope with looking after a severely disabled child that would need care 24 hours a day on top of looking after other siblings who need me as well? Maybe I would be even forced to do so on my own because the father doesn`t want to handle the strain any more, insists on a divorce and disappears?

Being a mother doesn't make you egoistic. Please don't even call it like this. You said you are disabled. Still you have a child and take of your daughter. This means you are not selfish. You sacrifice your time, your life, everything you can give to your daughter. You didn't kill her because she would be a nuisance in your life. I think you are a very good mother and your daughter can be proud of you. You are a person, a very good example to follow.

If you had more children and you wouldn't be able to cope with looking after them it would be wise to provide them with a foster family. And still, you would be able to see them. There are better options than annihilating a life before it's even born.

Everyone will agree or disagree with this topic. It's something that there's no obvious solution. Our views may be the same and some will definitely differ. I've all heard it here and there. Even my Government argues about this issue and about in-vitro. Soon, I guess, abortion will be called a treatment.

I've only expressed my opinion.

@S41kop4thy - you have a right to your opinion. With all due respect I shall not comment because our views differ. I do respect it but that's all I can say. I hope you understand. :)

[Seraphina]

I tend to be of the opinion that someone who has never been in the position of having to consider having an abortion can't really pass comment on it with any kind of authority. I can't imagine that it is anything but a gut wrenching position to find yourself in, and I doubt that many people who get an abortion do so lightly. I doubt that most of us can really understand how it feels, or what goes on in the head of people having to make that choice. For that same reason, it seems thoroughly insensitive to me to dictate reasons to people who have had to go through with one, or pass off their motivations as selfish and/or self centred.

Chalking it up to selfishness on the part of the mother is, at best, a gross oversimplification. I think the suggestion that abortion is used simply as an alternative method of contraception is unfounded, and that neither other individuals or certainly religion have any right imposing their own choices on what a woman does or does not do with her own body. Those who are against abortion have every right to make the decision not to have one...they have no right whatsoever to either judge those who have, nor do they have the right to attempt to legislate their beliefs in order to make the choice for everyone.

Abortion must be a choice. Not an easy one, I'm sure, but an available choice nonetheless for those that feel it is necessary for them.

[Riki]

I genuinely think that this is one of the hardest discussions/opinions to ever have to argue/decide - I agree with Seraphina that, as someone who has never had to make this kind of decision, we cannot truly understand the emotions and turmoil one would have to go through upon making it and therefore, are probably not the best people to be able to make a complete opinion on it - which is why I'm completely on the boundary line with it. No matter what, I think that as soon as the first beat of the heart is evident from the foetus, it is a living being and abortion, in a painstakingly-simple description, is some form of murder.

However, as humans and as another living organism on this planet, the killing of innocent beings is, unfortunately, a part of everyday life of any organism - I am, somewhat, religious but that's a complicated mash of stuff I have decided to form for myself over the past few months - Survival of the fittest is something I completely agree with and in pretty much every case of life, this is what it boils down to - even as an embryo this is evident - in order for that one to 'win' another had to lose. Nature decides on what we, as humans, are capable of doing, so perhaps the concept of abortion is some very backwards version of nature taking its course.
But then again, I am also of the opinion that one should leave well enough alone, in matters of appearance (plastic surgery, creams and the like) and personally, health - (I say personally meaning as such, because I've always found that when on the occasion I am Ill, riding it out and avoiding medication, as much as possible, works the most) - especially when it comes to these '99.9% kills all bacteria' stuff - I'm sorry, but my mother let me eat mud as a child, and from what I've experienced, I've gained a good immune system from it - which is the best way of avoiding illness - embrace it don't run away from it (Not to say, don't clean and be hygienic -or eat mud for that matter -, of course not, but I truly don't get people who are so afraid of germs and general illness) - While that is bordering off topic, my point is, I also don't think humans should really mess around with nature and something as intricate as pre-natal life, it's just too . . . out-of-bounds. I do think we may end up kicking ourselves in the foot if we get any more experimental.

As B.Haddrell pointed out, I think it's mostly down to the circumstance and why one may want or need to abort, I do not agree with something as stupid as a teenager being too stupid and naiive, but then again, under their care, they may not have the most rewarding life either - it could go two ways. For Health issues regarding the child and or the mother, I can understand more - although we are in a time where care for such issues can rectify it, or make handling such a life easier to manage, perhaps it's how strong you are personally that would be the key component here. Rape - this one I can understand completely, although no, it is not the unborn childs fault, having to live with the fact that the child that grows up under your care was born out of malice and evil could become very difficult (but yes there is always adoption - but again, that may not always be the best solution)

I hoped typing this I would come to a firmer decision, but alas, I am just as conflicted as before :confused: Apologies in advance for the partial off-topicness of this post :S

[Lady Valkyrie]

This is a weighted discussion and I respect the religious viewpoint of not robbing God of his children, as my mother herself is a Christian, maybe not an entirely dedicated one, but I do support pro-choice within the right reasons.

Nobody can tell another person what the right reasons for aborting a child are and what the wrong reasons are, I stand by the belief that you as a person have a dedication to yourself as a woman and a person, before that of a religious or cultural viewpoint. You are born firstly, a member of the human race with rights, in most countries, to pro-choice and to pro-life, a religious or cultural viewpoint is you'd hope by your own choice, you take up that mantel. I realize that some children are baptized shortly after birth or raised in a society where aborting a child could be considered the ultimate taboo but there are also societies that don't support sex before marriage, cultures that will marry off their children without their consent.

A woman should always know what she's getting into when she has sex? I cannot entirely agree with that nor disagree with it as birth control is not 100% accurate, my mother was taking the contraceptive pill when I was conceived and no matter how safe you try to be, at the end of the day you're not entirely. My mother made the decision to abort a child before me (in her early twenties), she wasn't emotionally, physically or financially ready to have a child - and I agree with those decisions. She made the decision herself and the father didn't get a say or even know about it.

The right to abort should be that of the woman's but in some situations I do think the father should be consulted as well, especially if you plan to start a family in the future, the father's fertility may be decreasing and the child you could abort may be the only one you get. My mother is lucky, my father managed to give her three children all without any serious health problems from his late thirties into his mid forties. A woman I know is getting to be in her late thirties and has aborted before, trying to have a child now and has failed to carry the fetus to full term more than once before.

You could argue the matter of "don't have sex, if you're not prepared to get pregnant" but in cases of sexual abuse and then pregnancy, I certainly do not believe I could have that child. In fact, I'd probably have to abort it as it could be a reminder of the abuse I suffered and that I didn't get a choice. You always deserve a choice, however abortion should not be used as a form of contraceptive - birth control is a much better option and most likely a much cheaper option. The latest I know and have heard of doctors allowing abortion to go to is around 20 weeks, which at that stage force labor may have to be induced and the fetus may even have to be pulled apart limb from limb in order to extract it.

I've never had either of the above procedures done or had to abort, though I do believe that is way too late to be considering abortion - the pregnancy is half-term. If you have to abort or wish to, I believe sooner rather than later is the best possible procedure. I agree somewhat with S41kop4thy, in saying that bringing a child into an ugly world and making it suffer is a crime - I find it awful when you hear about women constantly having children in third world countries when they barely can support themselves or their children may be raised in slavery. It may not always be by the women's consent that she has that child or she may not have access to birth control, but if she can - in those types of situations - I would advise not having sexual intercourse at all.

There is more I could say on this topic and I respect the views of those that are either pro-choice or pro-life, you may even consider yourself both within the circumstances, but I believe abortion cannot be an easy choice and shouldn't be taken lightly. You however do have an option and right to make that choice.

[eljay]

ITT: so many different opinions!

Overall I agree with this:

I tend to be of the opinion that someone who has never been in the position of having to consider having an abortion can't really pass comment on it with any kind of authority.
For now, I'm a moral relativist. I think whether I'd agree with someone's decision to 'abort or not to abort' would be on a case-by-case basis, but you can't really tell how you'd react to each case without being in that position yet.


Abortion must be a choice. Not an easy one, I'm sure, but an available choice nonetheless for those that feel it is necessary for them.
I also say "abortion must be a choice", but for different reasons; for me it seems less a matter of catering for those who feel it necessary and more of a matter of the important effect that the introduction of definitive choice has on pregnancy as an institution (can't think of a better synonym). For example, I currently feel that the knowledge that the option for deliberate and reliable abortion exists offers a necessary sense of security to women considering pregnancy - how could you enter into one otherwise?

The case in point being: a few months back I read an article about an Irish woman who died of blood poisoning because her fetus died inside her naturally and because of Ireland's strict anti-abortion laws her doctors where too afraid of legal prosecution to remove the dead fetus promptly, and refused to assist her. Because of the delay and the need to confirm and reconfirm fetal death, by the time they finally removed it she had already developed the septicemia that would kill her. In any country without anti-abortion laws, doctors would have been able to act swiftly in response to her medical emergency, without fear, and her death could easily have been prevented. Knowing this, I could not possibly feel secure about entering into a pregnancy if I were a woman living in Ireland or in any other country with similar laws. Ergo, I think its worth considering how the choice effects the entire system :-/

[Ryoma]

I'm against abortion, but I don't judge other people for wanting to choose it. There are obviously rape victims and other out of left field cases that are horrific and have some logical and ethical backing for pro-choice. I get that, but I cannot consciously support abortion.

[CommanderEivlys]

I'm religious, but I will always be Pro-choice. Having a child is a very hard decision, and pregnancy in itself is very difficult. For me, it's putting the life of what has the potential of life (since at that stage, the foetus is just a pack of cells without consciousness) against a real life (the mother). And I've always disliked the idea of "Women knew what they were going in for!". No, they didn't. They wanted to have sex, not a baby. They didn't sign up for one. If they get pregnant by accident and don't want the child, they have the right to take decisions about their own body, especially as pregnancy can be traumatic or even life-threatening for some women. My mother almost died when having me. If she hadn't wanted me, can you imagine how worse it would have been, to go through all this horror for something you never wanted and were forced to bear?

Furthermore, even as a Christian, I believe that by taking away abortion you cause far more death than with abortion. The women who don't want these children, especially as a product of rape, will simply find unsafe ways of getting one and will risk death or infertility in the future.

That's my opinion. Forcing someone to go through an unwanted pregnancy is one of the worst things you can do to someone.

[Sasha]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/532886_474011349337004_2084558301_n.jpg

I agree with Carlin.