[Ulquiorra - Good or Bad?] [Archive]

Velius

08-16-2007, 09:37 PM

Well, right about now the same thing could be said about Grimm. Hell, if people wanted to, they could say the same thing about Halibel. lmao. "OMGBBQ she's just standing there! Maybe she will help or something!" All depends how far you are willing to read into things. Or I guess I should say, to far.

The arrancars are the badies and will stay that way until Kubo kills them or makes them do the old switchero. At this point, the only one even close to that is Grimmjow. Even that has no real story support to back it up.

Rain

08-16-2007, 09:43 PM

I don't think he (or any villain for that matter) is completely evil, but he is on the evil side, and I don't see him switching sides (nor do I want him to)

Evility

08-17-2007, 05:42 PM

Well, first of all Grimmjow didn't save Ichigo or at least, you could hardly say it was a "saving". Grimmjow did that for his own benefits, to see for himself who is stronger. I don't think you could say you "save" somebody just to kill him later. This is more like a mouse-and-cat game.

In the same line of thoughts, Ulquiorra can't be determinated evil // not-so-evil // adorable-pink-bunny-who-loves-everybody or whatever you wish to say. He was originaly a Hollow and Hollows devour human souls. Unlike Orihime's brother, he went through a long evolution and nothing can make him do something, considered "humanely". I think it's obviously why he didn't killed Ichigo - it won't worth the effort.

And, last but not least, he does what Aizen tells him to do. It's a bit strange, but I think it's possible that Aizen told Ulquiorra to beat Ichigo, but not to kill him.

NightMare

08-17-2007, 06:20 PM

I think he is neutral

cleodux

10-25-2007, 08:35 AM

Well i only know one thing. Ulquiorra respects Aizen(because he knows Aizen is powerful), he sees everything in value (human, arrancar, vasto, Aizen :o) he knows Aizen is more powerful than him, so Ulquiorra follows Aizen order, no matter what it is (including kidnapped Orihime)

And i think Ulquiorra doesn't know how to differentiate good or bad >_< he merely follows order. So i don't think he is bad. That is my opinion.

Sergelia

10-25-2007, 09:14 AM

Ulquiorra is one of those villain types that you can't claim are pure evil, but would look idiotic if claiming they are good, too. Yet he's not neutral. He's just... there. What I want to say is, his loyalties are with Aizen, but his morality is questionable; he doesn't look like he takes pleasure in killing, he seems to be intrigued by Orihime to the point where he tries badly to understand her way of thinking (disregarding the Big Plan along the way), and he even goes as far as to provoking Ichigo to fight him without any obvious need to do so. Everything that Ulquiorra does is usually fairly simple, but the motives behind it are never clearly revealed (except when he makes it obvious he's acting on Aizen's accord). So... we'll know when Kubo wants us to, ne?

As for me, I believe he'll never be *good*, but will die to protect someone *cough*Hime*cough*. That's enough for him not to be evil in my book.

Syn

10-25-2007, 11:00 AM

I am not sure if I see Ulquiorra as a 'neutral evil', 'lawful evil', 'lawful neutral'. I think the last may be the closest one to his personality. Lawful meaning that he'll always keep his say, no matter what [see his relationship with Aizen and Inoue] and neutral because he doesn't seem to care if what he does is good or bad.

But, as much as I like him, I agree that he shouldn't switch side; that'd be just cheap for him. I am not sure if he'll die or not [I still think he won't], but I think he might learn about humanity through Inoue and maybe help her in his own way.

cleodux

10-25-2007, 11:28 AM

I don't want Ulquiorra to die either >_< and i agreed with Syn, i don't want Ulquiorra suddenly switch side to the good side. He is not neutral either. He is just somewhere beside Orihime :yell :yell

And like Sergelia said on her post, my feelings also tell me that Ulquiorra somewhat obsessed(intrigued) by Orihime, and so... at least it is one of the reason that make this HM arc interesting enough to read.

Guildenstern

10-25-2007, 12:06 PM

Chaotic neutral so far, might poss. change to chaotic good later. He's a very interesting character, and I think he's got some complex thoughts and emotions hidden away behind his blank facade.

Very much looking forward to more Ulquiorra characterization.

Cezaria

10-25-2007, 12:11 PM

THIS IS RELEVANT TO MY INTERESTS.

He's independent of good or evil, I think. Nothing he had done had been particularly "evil" or "good". But then again, it depends on your definition of those two terms, and whether you think Aizen is actually evil since the Espadas serve him.

No, I can't see him switch sides either. He's just not the type to become "friends" with Ichigo. Grimmjow is that type, Ulquiorra isn't. Personally I just think he'd be in some ways helpful towards Orihime, but ignores the rest of the gang.

Syn

10-25-2007, 12:12 PM

Mmh, I don't think that Ulquiorra is 'chaotic'. If anything, that's something I never thought about him; neutral yeah, lawful, yeah. But chaotic? :confused: Why?
A chaotic neutral/chaotic evil (I'd say chaotic neutral bordeline evil XD) would be more GJ (who never listens orders).

Cezaria

10-25-2007, 12:14 PM

I think what Guild means is the inconsistency factor in the way he acts. Sometimes he's dead loyal to Aizen, sometimes he's not, sometimes he even tells lies to his own side. We just never know why.

Syn

10-25-2007, 12:20 PM

His loyalty is only towards Aizen; he's not really inconsistent. All his other behaviours could be explained through the 'neutral' vision of D&D. Chaotics people aren't trustworthy and never swear loyalty to anyone (or if they do, you can be sure that it'll be forgotten in the next hour... XD). I don't see Aizen giving the mission to babysit Inoue to someone who will never obey orders.

Natsu

10-25-2007, 02:01 PM

Not good, not bad.. just loyal, and for that loyalty I think he will end up dead.

He's not appealing to me as a character, and I don't feel all the generalized "empathy" towards him õ.O So yeah.. just another villain in my opinion.

kuchiruki

10-25-2007, 02:51 PM

i think ulquiorra isn't completely bad, but how syn said, he's really loyal to aizen. so he belongs to the "bad side" and i don't think that fact will change. :cry it's too bad about him.

snowlesswinter

10-28-2007, 01:39 AM

I love him. Hope he would turn out good.

Sidonzo

10-28-2007, 05:10 AM

I agree with the posters that say he is on the side of evil, but himself is probably neutral. If he wasn't one of Aizen's Espada, I could see him somewhere in a cave in the depths of Hueco Mundo, coming out only to feed on other hollows at times...isolated, alone, and not a danger to humans anymore. As an arrancar he seems distant and cold at first, but he seems to have an honest curiousity about Hime (I bet he hasn't been around any humans in years...decades even) and is reserved and polite. So he has both good and evil qualities. He also shows restraint in dealing out death, we haven't seen him kill anyone on a whim yet and in fact seems to disapprove of it. He also treats Hime with respect and protects her from other arrancar that would treat her sorely. I personally think he shows quite a bit of good qualities, but being loyal to Aizen and having no qualms doing evil for Aizen still puts him squarely on the evil side. I don't think he is pure evil himself though and may surprise us one day by doing something very good...though I doubt he will ever join the good side and like others on here, I wouldn't want him to.

~Sid

rei_ai

11-06-2007, 06:13 AM

Even if he has at Aizen's side, it doesn't count him as 'bad'. Like many had said, he's loyal and that loyalty reflects his personality. He seems like a perfect subordinate to me. That loyalty to aizen is an amazing trait that's why i want him to stick to his side until he dies. That's the Ulquiorra I know.

Just a side note--he's calm on the surface, but he knows how to taunt an enemy. Such smart words coming from his pokered face.

i apologize if i came a bit off-topic >.<

Agmaster

11-08-2007, 06:09 PM

He is a robot. My bad, IT is a robot.

I have to not support CN as Guild stated earlier. LN with loyalty for whatever reason to Aizen. I'd never credit him with being true neutral as this is shounen jump and that just takes too much work on the writer's part. And Chaotic Neutral has a bit more energy to it. It follows the rules, to a tee, no more no less.

Personality (snicker) wise, it's more neutral evil. It chides and insults when it can get away with it. Course, it does this so rarely that I really don't want to credit him...(it?) with that.

Frostman

11-08-2007, 06:24 PM

Honestly i think he is working undercover for Uraharra. He had so many opportunities to kill Ichigo. Aren't these Espada suppose to be ruthless monsters.

Primera Espada

11-08-2007, 06:41 PM

Aren't these Espada suppose to be ruthless monsters.
no, that's hollows.
arrancar are allowed to plot, and plan, and calculate, which is what Ulquiorra does.

For what end, I won't argue, but the notion of "he's not a bloodthirsty monster, so he must be good" is flawed. Aizen was amiable, calm, calculating, and turned out as evil as hitler.

scooz

11-08-2007, 06:44 PM

Ulqui has almost all the signs of a sociopath. Chances are he is not evil as in he goes out of his way to be what he considers bad. He is just acting on what his twisted perception of the world is. Hollows survive by consuming souls and becoming more powerful anyway, so what he does is probably not evil to him. So from our p.o.v. he seems like a bad guy, but when you look at it from his side, he's not that bad.

Besides, we hardly know anything personal about him. We have seen stuff about Grimmjow and Nel that give us insight to who they are and why they act the way they do, but we haven't seen Ulqui's side of the story, so who knows.

Miyona

11-08-2007, 09:59 PM

Hes an espada...of course hes bad. I havent seen anything that would make me not think that yet..

Nessie

11-08-2007, 10:22 PM

To me hes stuck in the middle. I think he does things for his own gain. Like he will obey Aizen's orders just so he can stay on the bad side. Deep down he hates SS, hates Shingami and wouldn't mind to be in the people who rule the world category. If he had the power like Aizen he'd be top notch and doing as he would do.

Rain

11-09-2007, 02:31 AM

Ulquiorra isn't bad, but he probably leans toward the bad side. He doesn't seem to desire any type of superior power (the most common bad-guy trait) but he isn't a savior to anyone, nor will he help anyone if it won't help him.

scooz- that seems like a pretty good defintion for what he is:D

Ulquiorra

11-09-2007, 02:52 AM

he's one of the more sophisticated merciful bad guys

which is what makes him so loveable :love

Anne[w]

11-09-2007, 03:12 AM

Man, Ulquiorra is soooooooooooo strange! XD

But I don't think that him is REALLY REALLY evil. He is only a loyal Aizen's subordinate. Just follows Aizen's orders, without an own side at all.

Narcoleptic Curator

11-09-2007, 03:06 PM

Ulquiorra is lawful neutral.

Hiraga

01-19-2008, 03:20 PM

I wouldn't say he is bad, nor he is good... I mean, we haven't seen him doing anything bad (except when he beat Ichigo). I hope we will find out something about him in the next chapters, because I think we don't know anything about him besides he is loyal to Aizen.

lookingback7

01-19-2008, 06:29 PM

Lawful neutral is the best way to describe him, I think.

Ulquiorra is the sort of character who adds subtlety to the shounen plot. Only the careful reader of the manga will pick up on it. By careful I don't mean obsessive or prejudiced (for him), but sensitive to nuance. I know, lol - what an idea! But seriously, he was not really even on my radar until he began to show slight inconsistencies that made me say to myself, "this character is not what he seems." I for one really enjoy that sort of thing. It's refreshing.

Ulquiorra isn't flashy like Grimmjow or Renji (who are awesome, don't get me wrong). I think he (among other unusual characters like Urahara) serves to keep Tite interested in his own magna. I mean come on! Writing that non-stop for years has got to be tiring.

I could go down a list of instances that show that Ulquiorra has thoughts and motivations of his own aside from simply serving Aizen; an odd sentence here and an expression there. These things are not accidents. An artist does not take the time to carefully and subtlety illustrate expressions for no reason, believe me! It's too freaking hard and takes too much effort, even for someone as skilled as Kubo Tite. No, Tite put those expressions there because he wanted us to see them. They are there for the people looking for something just a little deeper in the plot than the fights, but they don't interfere with the basic shuonen style of the manga. Personally, these and other in-obvious character interactions are what keep me reading the thing.

So, is Ulquiorra evil? Depends on our POV. He's a antagonist, yes, but he doesn't go out of his way to commit murder and mayhem, like some. In fact he has restrained them on at least two occasions, (Yammi, Grimm). I think he is purely motivated by what HE wants to do. He serves Aizen because HE chooses to. Because it serves HIS interests. Have you noticed that he doesn't kneel to Aizen?

Anyway, this is getting long enough, suffice it to say that Ulquiorra serves Aizen because it serves his interests to serve Aizen. After all, didn't Aizen promise them freedom? If this makes Ulqui a sociopath, ok, I can totally buy that.

phantomfork

01-23-2008, 05:00 PM

I think he is purely motivated by what HE wants to do. He serves Aizen because HE chooses to. Because it serves HIS interests. Have you noticed that he doesn't kneel to Aizen?

But the question at this point is, what are those interests? This sort of character development is what I'm most looking forward to as far is Ulquiorra is concerned.

ForteAnly

01-27-2008, 12:46 AM

Ulquiorra might be considered bad because of the side he follows and his hollow origins. He's willing to follow Aizen just so he could accomplish his ambition regardless of the actions that Aizen might commit.

Miyona

01-27-2008, 01:21 AM

Hm, why would Ulqy not be bad?

I havent seen anything to make him seem good...

Jaina

01-29-2008, 06:39 PM

It's not that I think he's secretly a woobie or is about to turn around and switch sides, but Ulquiorra lacks that inner fire of true believers that even Tousen seems to have. So he's a villain, but not a Villain, if that makes sense to anyone but me. I think lookingback7 made a very good assessment.

wicked_liz

01-29-2008, 11:16 PM

Orihime-Chan

01-30-2008, 12:20 AM

good or bad, I don't care as long as he doesn't burst out laughing madly out of nowhere like a certain someone from Naruto.. :hm his perfect image will be shattered for ever in my eyes.:noworry

mechaqua

01-30-2008, 01:55 AM

For me Ulqui falls under Lawful Evil.

Sure he doesn't seem as actively into the mayhem as others, but he's still on Aizen's side.

I like that he's not an impassioned follower, it makes him interesting to watch 'cause one never knows when his agenda may switch.

But I really hope Kubo isn't going to start the "reforming the baddies" cliche. He already somewhat did it with the SS Captains, but they were ambiguously evil - their goals weren't the imminent destruction of your domain.

That said, still a bad guy.

i don't thin ulqui is quite lawful evil he rarely acts on his own accord even when he does it's because its because he needs to persue a previous order, like when grimmjaw released orihime ulqui only persued them he was instructed by aizen to keep her imprisoned grimmjaws actions were in direct conflict of this order. yes Lawful evil people tend to tend to seek allies to further there goals, but ulqui does not follow that pattern he has his own interests obviously but seems to put his orders above these interests this a pattern of those of the chaotic neutral alignment, uliq seems more neutral about things, and doesn't seem to express any emotions or care if anything good or bad happens

noimlucky

02-07-2008, 07:27 PM

And, last but not least, he does what Aizen tells him to do. It's a bit strange, but I think it's possible that Aizen told Ulquiorra to beat Ichigo, but not to kill him.

I wouldn't hold it past Aizen to order Ulquiorra not to kill Ichigo. It's either that or Aizen never told Ulquiorra to kill Ichigo, so if he does, he'd be disobeying Aizen. By leaving Ichigo barely alive, he technically didn't kill him, which means he technically didn't disobey Aizen.

Gotta love those loopholes.

As far as Ulquiorra being evil, good-secretly-masquerading -as-evil, or neutral, I don't think we've seen enough to Ulquiorra to really judge that. Honestly, I think he does whatever he's told to do. He's ordered to go to Earth and gather information on Ichigo or Orihime or whatever. He's ordered to kidnap Orihime then to watch over her. I think (and my memory is failing me right now, so please correct me) Ulquiorra has never acted without some kind of visible order... with the exception of almost killing Ichigo, but I've already said my deal with that.

rvngu

03-07-2008, 07:39 PM

pretty much agree with above. although, yeah ulqui was instructed to kill ichigo in the arrancar arc but was he instructed to kill ichigo just recently?

Shdo

03-07-2008, 07:49 PM

err rpg aligment on bleach character...lawful neutral...just because he is working for aizen dosnt make him bad, hell does that mean nell is bad? she seems to me lawful good.

good and evil got nothing to do with politics.

Revan1990

03-07-2008, 08:20 PM

I just think Ulquiorra is following his own interests...dont have an idea which ones, but he just seems to be as loyal to Aizen, cuz 1. Aizen is stronger and 2. Aizen's actions seem to be in his interests for now...however Ulquiorra is definitley more then he looks like, imo

Matoucs

03-07-2008, 08:36 PM

Defenetly BaD !

Risingblade

03-07-2008, 09:45 PM

Not good or evil more neutral

Fazal-sama

03-08-2008, 12:18 AM

probably cause he thinks ichigo is no treath to aizen so he just lets him go, and waste no more time on him.
and the only reason that he's kind to inoue is because she's important to aizen >_<

So yeah he's just neutral.

Mars

03-08-2008, 02:56 AM

Hmm, and what would Ulquiorra do if he was in charge..?

shinebunny

03-09-2008, 01:40 AM

I see Ulquiorra as a very loyal character. He's not evil - he's not motivated by bloodlust or righteousness like other Espada seem to be... it's more like, 'there's nothing worth living for but Aizen'. I could see him 'joining' the protagonists ONLY on the condition that he found something he cared for more than Aizen; someone new to completely defer to. If you notice, 99% of what he does is follow the orders of Aizen - when left to his own devices, he's apathetic.

Except... if you want to take a leap, you could say that he's demonstrated some different behavior regarding Orihime. If he were to develop strong feelings for her (sorry for bringing shipping into this; just write it off as speculation) then I could see him 'switching' sides.

No matter what, I think it's safe to say he'll never be a 'heroic' character - not like Ichigo, going out of his way to be everyone's superman.

Basically, Ulquiorra's alleigance is to his loyalties, and not to a cause, or a way of thinking. So it's hard to say whether he's 'good' or 'bad', because his nature does not seem to swing either way.

Air

03-09-2008, 01:52 AM

Neutral.. cause he really doesn't care about anything.

As said in his poem.

Mars

03-09-2008, 02:30 AM

Maybe his ''loyalty'' is a perfect mask for an upcoming plot, same as with Tousen for example.

bradc

03-09-2008, 02:45 AM

Actually Uliquiorra isn't dead; the minute Yammy disappeared, Uliquiorra also disappeared. Those two are inseparable like The Epic of Gilgamesh; on the eldest myths of Babylon. They are also like husband and wife, only the that they are companions on a quest to become human.

I hope this helps <3

WarriorsRest

03-20-2008, 06:12 PM

Ulquiorra's character isn't about emotion, therefore good/evil isn't really descriptive enough to encompass his position or capabilities. Most characters who personify evil are filled with anger and hate and those personifying good are filled with love and kindness. Ulquiorra is indifferent, and that indifference is what makes him so dangerous and a valuable weapon/tool for those who are evil. Indifference should actually be the true opposite of love, if love is described to be the epitome of emotion, because it is the lack of emotion. Ulquiorra does exactly what is asked of him without question. He could care less who dies or who lives, he knows his place and follows orders.

Aizen wants to use Ichigo to see how far the new shinigami can be pressed to gain power. We have to remember that Aizen has peaked in his own power, and the whole story line has shifted to a focus on him finding a new way to reach new heights. He see's a potential in Ichigo and is intrigued by how far Ichigo can advance and how quickley. Ulquiorra killed Ichigo because he analyzed that Ichigo hadn't progressed as Aizen thought he would, therefore Aizen didn't want to use him anymore. Ichigo would have died had not Inoue healed him, the wound was mortal.

igniz

03-20-2008, 07:57 PM

Ulquiorra good or evil?
Compared to a pure evil character like Noitra, Ulquiorra looks like an angel. Still it'd be far exaggerated to qualify his personality as "good" : he is quite insensitive to other's suffering and he is scornful, especially to weak people he easily labels as "garbage". So he is evil in a cold mild-mannered way: he'll not hesitate to kill whoever gets in his way if necessary, but he will not enjoy it or go on useless killing spree. As someone who like order, he'll despise sadistic behavior (like Yammy gratuitous murders) but he'll not go as far as to do something against it.