Will Rukia learn Bankai?

[Amy corE]

That would be wonderful if Rukia will learn bankai^^ It's my dream to see Sode no Shirayuki's spirit!:wtf
Rawr, I want her to learn that bankai thing. I think Kubo wants too xD So, "Yes".

[StarlaBlaise]

Someday she'll sure learn. I don't think Kubo-san will loose such an opportunity to show her sword skills, considering the beauty of Sode no Shirayuki's shikai. :)
But when? Who knows?

[hideseeker]

Everyone in the story is likely to get a few power upgrades, depending on how long Kubo will drag the story.

[Linabana]

As much as I love her I voted for no. Even with a shikai her zanpakuto continue to amaze the reader. Kubo can at least show what SnS looks like knowing it's the most beautiful zanpakuto

[Primera Espada]

Sode No Shirayuki turns out to look like....

Orihime!

no wonder they're such good friends XD

[Ileenka]

Sode No Shirayuki turns out to look like....

Orihime!

no wonder they're such good friends XD

Her sword's ribbons sticking out from the pommel would need to be orangey brown instead of white, and the guard of her sword would have to resemble two giant grapefruits. :)

[Linabana]

Haha ^_^;;
I think it looks like the opposite of Zangetsu: White and beautiful (I'm not saying Zangetsu is ugly >_<)

Hehe, off-topic

[Primera Espada]

I seriously think it's a bunny rabbit.

http://www.chickartisticcreations.com/snwbunny.jpg

[Ileenka]

Haha ^_^;;
I think it looks like the opposite of Zangetsu: White and beautiful (I'm not saying Zangetsu is ugly >_<)

Hehe, off-topic


Zangetsu is ugly. :cool:

Don't know if SnS will be the prettiful snow lady everyone is predicting her to be. Too predictable and boring, I'd rather if it were a white Thai Elephant.

[Amy corE]

I wanted Sode to be a unicorn:nuts One day..it was.. xD
Sure it will be something extremely beautiful. And Rukia, as a main heroine, deserves attaining bankai. I know she will:yell

[caramelmilktea]

yeah!Everybody will probably power up(it's shounen afterall),so it's quite natural for Rukia to achieve Bankai :noworryAnd of course it will be breath-takingly beautiful.:loveA white snow queen?nice,match zangetsu.But yeah,too predictable:rolleyes:,may be a white nine-tailed fox,or a white Rukia version herself :nuts

[Matoucs]

She'll get it in Bleach shippuden !!

[Marionette]

Her sword's ribbons sticking out from the pommel would need to be orangey brown instead of white, and the guard of her sword would have to resemble two giant grapefruits. :)
LOLZ, Kubo will smoke too much crack and this will happen, you'll see :D

Although I want a bunny rabbit too, than I'll totally ship Rukia/Shirayuki~ I'm more interested in that Rukia will be wearing for bankai. White kimono (with those wooden slippers and everything) would be an obvious choice.

[imamess]

As much as I love her I voted for no. Even with a shikai her zanpakuto continue to amaze the reader. Kubo can at least show what SnS looks like knowing it's the most beautiful zanpakuto

That's how I feel. I'm not saying she will never be able to, but she has a pretty decent winning record and is able to use more than strength to defeat enemies. I'd love so see her learn more awesome kidou moves from Byakuya.

Part of why I like Rukia's power is that she's had to really work for it. She came into the Gotei 13 feeling down because she was passed through school and placed because of her brother. She wanted to be treated like normal and found solace in Kaien who did that. To me (and this is entirely opinion), having her use the doll breaks that tradition of work. Not that using the doll isn't hard work, it just forcibly manifests the spirit, but it just kinda spoils it for me.

I have faith that Rukia will get stronger, I just don't think she necessarily needs bankai to do it. Plus, I'd love to see her take Kaien's place. I see her trying to fill his shoes in cheering up and training with Orihime, so I think that would make her character turn full circle.

[earthforge]

@imamess: Finally, somebody who agrees with me!

I agree, bankai ruins her atmoshpere of working hard for shikai. I believe when she's older, she'll achieve it. In fact, I've drawn her stance and am coloring it right now.

[Lady Mizura]

I think she will eventually. Maybe in this Arc?

[Ninira]

I think she will eventually. Maybe in this Arc?

I don't think she'd learn it in this arc, personally. That's a bit too soon. It's possible she'll learn bankai, and I won't really mind if she does. I just hope she doesn't cheat like Ichigo. :p

[Mad_Scientist]

I think she will learn Bankai before the end of the series, but I don't expect it to be anytime soon. I think the next major stage in Rukia's growth will actually be her being promoted to Lieutenant of of the 13 Division. (That would certainly make Koketsu and Kotsubaki gape in surprise, hehe.)

But I think Rukia will learn Bankai some time after that. I might not be for a while, it might even be in an epilogue chapter that takes place after the end of the main series, but I think it will happen.

[Velius]

Here is how I have always looked at it:

Rukia and Renji are from the same generation. Rukia was/is more skilled then Renji. (that we know from the flashbacks) Renji literally went from being able to just materializer to having Bankai overnight.

If Kubo wants it all he has to do is throw in one more time jump (the bigger the better) and it will be well within reason for Rukia to use it after said timejump/training. It might not even need that. I'm just saying that to be a bit more reasonable.

[boertush]

I think she does eventually, we only need a reason for her to achieve it:
renji: to save rukia
ichigo: to save rukia
ikaku: to beat kenpachi

maybe because she want to save orihime? or perhaps ichigo is kidnapped in the next arc?

[Marionette]

or perhaps ichigo is kidnapped in the next arc?
That's so made of win:rotflmaoRukia can gain bankai to stop the enemies while Chad carry him away like a princess~

[Fortunate]

or perhaps ichigo is kidnapped in the next arc?

Lol.

I hope so, and I'm sure she will. I mean, c'mon: Winter, Ice, Snow! Sounds like the perfect place and time to learn/use bankai. :p

[Kisa-chan]

well I really hope she achive the bankai soon ('cause she can achive it) and use it in Gin!(well, here I'm hallucinating)

That's so made of win:rotflmaoRukia can gain bankai to stop the enemies while Chad carry him away like a princess~

jajaja that idea make me alugh a lot xD

[Byakuya Kuchiki]

I thought she already knew bankai....:confused:

[Shdo]

its an insult if she get a bankai.
what next? hanataro?!

[Grey1x]

Indeed, it's an insult for the 2nd main character of the series get Bankai.

I don't think she will achieve it, I think she has it already!

[vaizado]

I dont want her to get BanKai.

Sure, the enemies require the good guys to have great power that's equal to a BanKai, but that's where the rest of the Captains and Lieutenants come in.

Kubo needs to develop THEM. The Captains all have Bankais and he can make them shine instead of constantly focusing on main characters.

Rukia already had her shining moment by kicking Aaronniero's ass. Time for her to step aside and let the rest of the high ranking Shinigami do what they do best.

To put it simply, I dont want her to get Bankai because that'd mean more Rukia-related plot. What BLEACH has is this amazing cast of characters yet they all take a backseat. Rukia getting Bankai would only mean more of this. With the recent turn of events, I hope the focus is set on the rest of the cast.

[ashido fan]

i think she will, she might use it during the winter war, anyway her shikai is ICE type, just perfect for a war during winter. or maybe she will learn it halfway thru the winter war due to the abundance in snow and ice...

[MOF^^]

She is the most important character after Ichigo.Bleach doesn't seem like it'll end soon,we have a lot of time in front of us(first of all).Second of all,Rukia is definitely stronger than Renji,he can't even use Kidou propertly.When she came back to the living world to start the war with Aizen,she already has her Shinigami powers,her own Zanpaktou and three dances.I can't see how can't she achieve Ban Kai even if she doesn't have a lot of time.
Rukia is very important person from Bleach-Kubo is developing her and Ichigo most.He'll not leave her without Ban Kai,because after all that's a shounen.Also,Bleach will earn more popularity.That's Kubo's purpose.

[Luhy]

i was a huge supporter of her having Bankai before the fight with Aeroniero... she had reason to have never needed to use it yet, seeing how fast all her fights were, but against him, she got incredibly angry and really went at him in the beginning... makes me wonder why on earth would she have held back?

the only hope right now to me, is that she would achieve it during a fight with one of Halibel's fraccions maybe... there aren't many enemies left she can fight either right now...

[couch_kamote]

Yeah, I'd like to see her achieve Bankai.

There's many on my list actually

Zaraki, Rangiku, Yachiru

some are those we assumed already has but haven't showed it yet like

Gin, Aizen, Soi Fon, Yuroichi, Urahara, Isshin, Yamamoto, and all the other captains and the Vaizards too.

[Grey1x]

Hmm, I think she held back because she is like Byakuya. In a certain way, Byakuya was also mad cuz Zomari tried to kill "his pride" but even so he just used bankai in the end as a "SHUT UP AND DIE".

I think Rukia will fight stark with Bankai, after stark uses his mind controlling ability (Speculation) to make Renji win vs Byakuya :D

[jazzjackrabbit]

i was a huge supporter of her having Bankai before the fight with Aeroniero... she had reason to have never needed to use it yet, seeing how fast all her fights were, but against him, she got incredibly angry and really went at him in the beginning... makes me wonder why on earth would she have held back?

the only hope right now to me, is that she would achieve it during a fight with one of Halibel's fraccions maybe... there aren't many enemies left she can fight either right now...

the reason why she held back might be due to her inner turmoil. Her fight with him was more different than any other fights in HM because of its psychological background. Rukia was(is) still blaming herself for Kaien's death so Aeroniero using that was the turning point of their fight.

anyway I think she will achieve Bankai, that is if she doesn't have it already. We didn't know that she had a third shikai and we know that very few people in SS have more than one Shikai(she has three) and also she is very talented in kido which requires lots of concentration, especially doing them without the incantations. So at that level Rukia seems closer to Bankai than any other one...

[Shdo]

people will go to great lengths just to prove to themselfs that their fav character is more strong then it is. besides she dosnt need bankai, she got plotkai and that is the strongest thing in existance.

[Agmaster]

It's not plotkai it's a mixture of resolve and kuchiki white deck hacks. I mean come on now. How do YOU explain a corpse downing someone as strong as Hanatarou?

[Marionette]

people will go to great lengths just to prove to themselfs that their fav character is more strong then it is. besides she dosnt need bankai, she got plotkai and that is the strongest thing in existance.
Oh I totally know what you mean; when some other character does won than it has to be plotkai, and when their favorite goes down it's also plotkai, because it doesn't makes sense in their minds so it just can't be how it is.

[earthforge]

Again, I doubt she'll need bankai and here's why:

She can inherit Nejibana!

Ok, I can dream, but I don't think she'll acheive bankai. She's getting better at the sword and is very powerful, but she has no biological relation to Kuchiki taichou. Her area is kidou, and I think she can were with Byakuya on that area. Not the sword because they have very different tactics.

[rvngu]

hopefully not. bankai are supposed to be rare and only to captains (except 3 exceptions). but maybe in 300-400 years she can.

[EX|pada #0]

Indeed, it's an insult for the 2nd main character of the series get Bankai.

I don't think she will achieve it, I think she has it already!

Haha, you TOTALLY made my day with your post.

Why not she can get bankai? Seriously, why not? Some people say it'll be strange for Rukia suddenly pop-up with a bankai, but, oh god, we never saw her day-by-day in Gotei 13, who can prove that she not already achieved bankai?

A good example is Renji and Ikkaku. They just suddenly poped-up with a bankai (We never saw them training. Ok, Renji trained one day, but anyways... :P) and everyone see it like a normal thing. Why can't be the same for Rukia?

[couch_kamote]

Yeah, every main character have been getting upgrades recently.

Ichigo being able to control his inner hollow.

Chad having two usable arms.

Ishida with all his tubes.

Inoue has finally known what her real powers can do.

What happened to Rukia?

I bet she'll achieve Bankai.

[Luhy]

I wonder where she would... not many enemies she can stand strong against, but we also know Kubo defys his own "power rankings" a lot... maybe she'll learn Bankai in a 2 on 1 with someone o.o

[couch_kamote]

Probably when they get back from Hueco Mundo.

[Luhy]

im wondering what future oponents she may encounter... maybe she'll learn it against a Vaizard o.o

[EX|pada #0]

lol, yeah, I wonder what enemies she can fight against from now too.

I don't think the vaizards will turn to the dark side but... dear god, besides them we just have the top 3 espada! Her bankai have to be REALLY KICK ASS if she wants to fight against them. Is really scary to think about this LOL

[Luhy]

yea i think so too... i wonder if she'll ever fight again at all unless we get new enemies in the future... maybe she could Bankai vs another Privaron Espada? o.o

[EX|pada #0]

Ahh, her bankai have to be showed against a decent enemy. I hope it will be a epic thing (Hey, is not everyday that a shinigami who is the co-protagonist reach your limit!), so it will be... shameful if her have to use this against a just PRIVARON espada. So... I really don't know who is the enemy that will force her to use bankai, seriously XD

Maybe some new enemies will appear or something.

[couch_kamote]

Yeah, I bet it'll be really cool. Her Shikai's abilities are already awesome so we can expect more great things about her Bankai.

[Luhy]

oooh, well, Yammy is physically stronger than Aeroniero right?... maybe she could against him o.o... I wanna see a Bankai based around snow... like her avalanche shikai ability XP

[EX|pada #0]

OMG, I TOTALLY forgot about Yammy (LOL!)! Yeah, he's really a good target for now XD

[couch_kamote]

I think snow is good. Since Hitsugaya uses ice already.

[Luhy]

thats what i was thinking too~ would be nice to see a lot of cute/chibi Bankai-inspired Rukia Fan-art is hats, puffy coats, and scarves XP

[vaizado]

A good example is Renji and Ikkaku. They just suddenly poped-up with a bankai (We never saw them training. Ok, Renji trained one day, but anyways... :P)

Uh, both Renji and Ikkaku trained before the series even started. It was revealed in the manga that Ikkaku taught Renji and Yumichika about Bankai. Why do you think Renji already knew materialization of his zanpaktou when we saw him train with Ichigo?

[Syn]

Well what's important to get bankai is how in tune the user is with his/her zanpakutou.
And we know that Rukia is reallyyyy in tune with her zanpakutou, probably even more than Matsu and Yumi who were shown training for bankai.

So, is it really that surprising to think that Rukia will obtain bankai?

[Navirae]

Have to agree with Syn. Also, I'm not certain, but Kubo hasn't said whether Rukia did train like Renji and Ikkaku either before the series. For all we know, she could have.

Example with her 'dances', we only got to see it and learn how and when she trained for those at the time that she first uses them during her fight with D-Roy. I don't believe it was even revealed how she was able to learn her third dance (not sure if it was explained since the first two were witnessed by Kaien, so we knew she trained for them at that point in time).

The entire concept of Bankai came into form when Ichigo needed it SS, and then slowly everyone else who might have had one is being revealed. So who knows, Rukia might obtain one, or is already capable of it. Just like her previous battles, it requires time and the need for it.

[EX|pada #0]

Uh, both Renji and Ikkaku trained before the series even started. It was revealed in the manga that Ikkaku taught Renji and Yumichika about Bankai. Why do you think Renji already knew materialization of his zanpaktou when we saw him train with Ichigo?

Okay, it was in a flashback. Like Navirae posted, Kubo didn't said that Rukia did the same or not. :rolleyes:

[Euregatto]

I sat yes cause it seems cooler ><

[Lax_Duke]

Voted yes. She has potential and as the lead character I would love to see SnS in bankai form

[Grey1x]

LOL at your avatar Euregatto.

I've got something to support she having bankai, but before that:

Regarding reiatsu, I believe it's either of these.
1. The reiatsu is allways the same and doesn't change..
2. Reiatsu increases as age increases in a proporcional way to everyone. Ex.: Kid 1 has more reiatsu than Kid 2. When adults, Kid 1 will still have more reiatsu.


If it is either of this, remember, on Renji's flashback, Rukia showed she had more reiatsu making that ball (or was it that she had better reiatsu manipulation? well let's hope it's the first one :headscratch).

[WarriorsRest]

Yes,
Rukia is the main female lead and kubo can't afford to allow her to stagnate. I believe that an ironic twist would help to revitalize the relationship between Rukia and Ichigo. Such as Rukia stepping in to save Ichigo. Ichigo is basically being buried by the power of the other Shinigami Captains and the top ranking Espada and it won't be long until Rukia will need to step up for them to have a chance of fighting side by side to help dispose of Aizen. Their relationship won't survive with one of them suped up and fighting with the other left behind. Rukia is a warrior, and her ability to stand next to Ichigo is why there is respect in their interactions.

[Risingblade]

She most likely will since shw's such an important charecter.

[Monz]

I hope not, I don't really like Rukia, I mean Bankai is supposed to be the top level a Shinigami can reach, if everybody starts doing it that sort of defeats it's purpose.

[Lina]

I hope not, I don't really like Rukia, I mean Bankai is supposed to be the top level a Shinigami can reach, if everybody starts doing it that sort of defeats it's purpose.

yeah me too...I dont think she will learn bankai....:notrust

[ChireMae]

@ Monz and Lina, I am glad that KT doesnt seek your opinions on whether Rukia should reach banakai :rolleyes:
Rukia will obtains bankai simply because she's Bleach lead heroine. She doesnt need too, but I willing to bet that KT will give her one. I find its amusing that even with all the upgrades her nakama have obtain, what with the devil's arm and power of god KT choose Rukia to be the first shinigami to kill a ranking espada.

[Amy corE]

Monz, you don't like her, huh?
Well, right now I think that Kubo should rather give bankai to Rukia than Ichigo.:hm
Besides, there is a lot of ways to reach bankai. I'm sure Rukia is capable of reaching it using any way.

[Grey1x]

Rukia was able to kill an Espada who "supposedly have very thick skin and their skin is inpenetrable with a simply shikai" with her shikai, that alone can show a lot of power / reiatsu, so she's more than capable of achieving Bankai, if she doesn't have already.

[Annie]

Ikaku has bankai and he's sure not a top level shinigami nor is Renji. I really don't expect people to cling onto bankai being a rare thing anymore.

However, I always insist that Rukia doesn't need bankai to prove her worth. Since having bankai doesn't guarantee a victory, I don't mind if Rukia never get one.

But she has potentials to achieve it, it's not a matter of whether you like her or not.

[EX|pada #0]

I was wondering... these people who says that Rukia will not achieve bankai, tell me how she'll fight from now on. Using only shikai? Wow, Rukia = Zaraki II?

To me, it's pretty obvious that she'll achieve (if she actually not have) bankai.

[Shdo]

she wont fight from now on. she passed the entire show with barely any fighting done anyways, especially fights she actually won in and seriously why should she fight any more strong opponents? the remaining espada are fighting captain level, they are too busy to even have a match with her, not to mention that she is stuck in HM and all the strong arrancars are not there so she will have weaklings to fight at best.

[EX|pada #0]

LOL, do you think that a major character like Rukia will just watch the decisive fights from now on? Furthermore, she just fought two times...

Hey, and many characters are stuck in Hueco Mundo too, do you think that they'll never fight again?

Besides, who can prove that Bleach is really ending in this arc?

Ah, and who is the "weaklings" that you're talking about?

[wicked_liz]

I hope not, I don't really like Rukia, I mean Bankai is supposed to be the top level a Shinigami can reach, if everybody starts doing it that sort of defeats it's purpose.

she wont fight from now on. she passed the entire show with barely any fighting done anyways,

Well the majority of the fan-base doesn't agree with you. Rukia is popular and beloved, Kubo won't just get rid of her. Even by default, he's gonna keep her.

But Rukia also plays an integral role in the manga. Kubo intentionally changed original elements of his story to match Rukia. I'm not trying to *up* her import, but let's not down-grade it either.

She spent the majority of the series powered down. So that when she finally used her zanpaktou - it was a Big Deal.

She's been noted as a talented fighter, but she's only had a limited number of fights to show her strengths, and both were AWESOME.

She's going to achieve bankai because that's the natural progression of her powers. Bankai isn't as speshsul as Byakushi made it out to be, since even Ikkaku had it, and Ken-chan only needed kendo to beat an Espada.

Saying she "can't" have it, because you don't like her, is petty and silly.

[Shdo]

and still for most of the show she didnt fought any major fights, only in the last arc she actually fought, one was against a weakling and the other was with the use of the all powerful plotkai, so there is no real reason for her to fight any major fights, especially when the other captains are fighting what left of the bad guys.

right now the only battle that will happen for any main good guy is the fight with ulquira and that belongs to ichigo.

the weakling is d-roy, an arrancar by name only.

ill be honest i dont like her, but even character i do like (as much as i can like fictional characters) i dont hope they will achive bankai. people here try to prove that she have bankai for the sole reason that they like her. personal prefences arent important here, what matter is making some sense and if possiable not making everything crappy. getting rukia to bring bankai out of nowhere when she had fine chances to bring one out or without anything to back it up will only make bankai look like something everyone have.

its like the espada losing all the time, there was a big hype on them and in the end they are a bunch of whimps, so the espada are pretty much degraded. much like bankai if any1 else will bring it out without being a captain first.

[EX|pada #0]

Like I said before, nothing was been showed about Rukia day-by-day in Gotei 13. I'll not get surprised if she always trained bankai.

[Shdo]

at least people dont say she have visards powers.

[EX|pada #0]

It would be bizarre.

[Shdo]

and that is what i think about her getting bankai, its bizzare, its pure fanservice and that makes that in poor taste. her fighting and bringing a forth dance i can understand but her getting bankai is too much just like her getting visard powers.

[EX|pada #0]

Ok, think what you want to. But every main character get a power up in every arc. And for her, at this time, the most probably is the bankai.

[Shdo]

more likely a forth dance. besides she will have ice bankai, we already seen ice bankai almost as much as we seen giant snake bankai. boring.

[EX|pada #0]

Well, if she gets a forth or fifth dance stronger than a bankai, to me it's ok.

Indeed I'll be more happy with this than with her achieving the bankai itself.

At least I'd can make fun of the others saying things like "Rukia no needed bankai to beat *** enemy! *laughs* :p"

"Bankai" is only a name, after all.

[Shdo]

what is stronger then a bankai? its a relative thing. byakuya shikai is better then ikkaku bankai not because he is stronger then ikkaku but because its perfect against 1 massive blade. for example her third dance, if Aaro didnt lowered her like that and stared at her like that from point blank then this he would have won, so in the end if you use something weak on something strong weak point then it will work but that dosnt mean its as strong as a bankai. keep in mind that this isnt dragon ball and abilities still have some importance (even if this arc really humpered this thinking)

[EX|pada #0]

Everything is relative, even in a bankai x bankai fight. So I think is pointless to discuss these things.

[Luhy]

to the people who say every that's left is too strong for Rukia: It's very possible she might fight some fraccions or Yami too~ not to mention, she could always use Bankai to save someone if they fight an enemy that's too strong by going Bankai x.x

[EX|pada #0]

I think that Rukia will fight against Yammy, Apache (don't ask me why) and finally, her final fight will be against Gin. At least I GUESS.

[Shdo]

shesh! leave somthing for the captains dammit.

[EX|pada #0]

There's a lot for the captains lol

[Monz]

I think that Rukia will fight against Yammy, Apache (don't ask me why) and finally, her final fight will be against Gin. At least I GUESS.

I don't think Rukia will fight Gin, nor do I think she would be a match for him.

[Miyona]

Or...

maybe Rukia wont whind up fighting anyone else?

[Shdo]

that is a very good option, she played her role, she laid kaien to rest, there is no enemy that is really related to her. every bad guy have more reasons to fight others good guys then rukia. i really doubt that she will have a fight from here and if was it would be against a weak enemy so there is no point for bankai against them.

[Monz]

Yeah I agree, I hope she just has a supporting role from the sidelines from now on.

[ChireMae]

Are you guys for real? She's a shinihami at war she will fight again. The main reason of the objective to Rukia's achieving bakai is because some of you dont like her characte, well tough she's the main heroine, wont suprise me one bit if she was there in front of Ulq by the time Ichigo gets to the fifth tower. But as a Rukia fan I am used to these kind of condescending attitudes, if she doesnt fight she's weak, she does fight and won then her opponent is weak/useless, nevermind two seconds ago he/she was praised and admired. I guess in your world the heroine should stand at the sideline clutching her preferably ample bosoms crying out the hero's name, heaven forbid the world would end if she actually fight and win and achieve bankai! :rolleyes:

[Annie]

Geebuz, for god's sake. Just because you cannot think of anyone for her to fight so you guys ended up hoping her role is over?

She's one of the MAIN cast. Her, Ichigo, Ishida, Chad and Renji will always has enemy to fight with. Simple.

Fighting anyone doesn't need a deep reason in Bleach. Or else Urahara wouldn't have fight Yammi nor Hitsugaya got owned by Luppi.

Supporting role is what you're hoping for. But like it or not, she'll fight later. Along side Ichigo, Renji, Ishida, Orihime (if she ever fight) and Chad.

This is not a thread for your opinions on who do you think could fight Rukia. It's about your opinion whether you thnik she'll get bankai or not.

[Shdo]

its related because people asked 'if she wont have bankai then how will she fight?' and the answer is simple. she wont.
in the entire show she had 2 types of fights, ones that she got owned badly and narrowly survived, and d-roy.

she dont need bankai for the first type.

[Fuzakeru]

I hope she doesn't achieve Ban Kai but if she does I hope its in a more classic shounen way of her getting her ass handed to her then she pulls inner strength, etc.

I could see her emo'ing over how many times a hand has gone through her chest and bursts out with a new dance.

I pretty much am on the same wave length as Shdo. I'd rather see Rukia play a supportive role since she hasn't been as intersting as she was in the start of Bleach.

[Syn]

Byakuya himself mentioned that she had fights ahead of her. So of course everyone expect her to fight.

Rukia is still the main female lead, and the fact that the focus shifted to Inoue for the time being doesn't mean that we won't see her anymore; I expect her role to become central again. And she will fight, certainly, which means that she'll have to achieve bankai sooner or later. Seeing that she is more in tune with her zanpakutou than Matsu and Yumichika who trained for bankai, is it really something to not expect from her?

[Grey1x]

Syn, I love you, really :wtf.

Wouldn't have said better myself.

[memopanda]

Okay, I wouldn't have thought she would get bankai (in the near future) because she'd need lots of time to train, but I acknowledge Syn's point that she is very in tune with Sode no Shirayuki... hmm.

[WarriorsRest]

Bleach's opening character was Rukia, and shortly after her introduction she developed a respectful and meaningful relationship with the main male lead. Which is fitting since SHE IS the main female lead. Kubo would be insane to drop the foundation out from under his main characters and make no mistake about it, leaving Rukia behind and out of fights, having her stagnate is completely destroying much of the first two arcs of bleach. The relationship Rukia has with Ichigo is based off of respect for one another and their abilities to be there for eachother. Even though Rukia can support Ichigo in different ways than fighting, such as emotional stabilizing as we seen when Ichigo was confronting his inner hollow there is much more to Rukia. She is a warrior and has proven her skill (especially with shikai) to be useful and worthy of being relied upon. Kubo will continue to develop her character and give her growth. Since bankai is the next step for her (and she is due) a logical analysis of the sequence of shinigami development would suggest a bankai to be achieved.

[Final Boss]

I don't see why she wouldn't, she's an important character and it would be interesting to see what it would be like.

[Shdo]

most of the show she didnt had fights, and she still was the main female lead. why do you think that her role will change now? she had two fights which were really needed, 1 against d-roy so that we will see her shikai, and one against Aaro so that her backstory with kaien will come to a rest.
from now on she can return to her original role as supportive and guiding character to ichigo and if you look at the remaning enemies you can see that they are way above her legue (1-3 espadas, aizen, gin, tousen. the friccons will die in karakura fights anyway).

besides, people say she will have a rage moment or something to get bankai but from what i seen bankai isnt SSJ1, you actually need to be calm to achive it and to subdue your zanpakutou and i doubt that you can do that in a fight.

[ChireMae]

most of the show she didnt had fights, and she still was the main female lead. why do you think that her role will change now? she had two fights which were really needed, 1 against d-roy so that we will see her shikai, and one against Aaro so that her backstory with kaien will come to a rest.
from now on she can return to her original role as supportive and guiding character to ichigo and if you look at the remaning enemies you can see that they are way above her legue (1-3 espadas, aizen, gin, tousen. the friccons will die in karakura fights anyway).

besides, people say she will have a rage moment or something to get bankai but from what i seen bankai isnt SSJ1, you actually need to be calm to achive it and to subdue your zanpakutou and i doubt that you can do that in a fight.

Jeez I dont know....maybe it's something to do with character development and growth? If Orihime was weak and not the lead herione can obtain a power of god upgrade, why should Rukia the Lead heroine does the same?

If you look at the manga at the end of SS arc she was basically powerless and in a space of two months she not only regained her former strength but her fighting techniques and power (from Kidou to the third dance) improve greatly! Look at her nakama who had power upgrades, which one of them had any awesome and meaningful fights? In fact Rukia killed the highest rank opponent among the group. Ichigo could have killed GJ but he opted not to. In fact Rukia had the most awesome fight in my opinion of the HM arc save for those by the captains.

As you say if you stay calm and focus to achieve bankai, then definely she will obtains it, cause she like her Ni sama is one of the intelligent fighters. I can understand if you dislike Rukia that you want her to be "one the sideline' look what happened when she displayed her third dance, her popularity shot to surpass Ichigo's. Imagine if she had bankai, which will be both beautiful and awesome, she might just shoot to no.1. The thought must have give Rukia haters those who dislike Rukia sleepless nights.:cool:

[Shdo]

yet orihime power, as godly as it is, isnt designed for battle, nor does she fight. so saying that if orihime got god powers then rukia should have bankai is flawed.

people wants her to have bankai only because they are her fanboy and fangirls. this is a flawed thinking, its irational and illogical. i dont want her to have bankai not because i hate her but because i dont want people to bring more bankais out of nowhere, and yes rukia bringing bankai out of nowhere.
i barely accepted ikkaku and you want to bring another non captain? 'but she is strong' no she isnt, never was and never will be, she is s supportive role(not healing but guiding) to ichigo, and she finished her fighting roles with Aaro.

gin will be defeated by either hitsugaya or matsumoto, tousen will be defeated by sajin, every arrancar in karakura will lose his\her fight (because TK sucks) and Aizen will be beaten by every top league character combined.
there is nothing left for her, nor do ishida and chad. keep in mind that for most of the show she didnt fight so why do you think she have to fight now?

[NeoSapien]

there is nothing left for her, nor do ishida and chad. keep in mind that for most of the show she didnt fight so why do you think she have to fight now?

If you don't expect Ishida or Chad to have any more fights, then you don't understand Bleach. Of course they (and Rukia) will! They are lead characters.

[Shdo]

sure they are lead characters but having them suddenly getting a powerup when the last one didnt even worked is simply repetitive, the most i can see them doing is to team up on a single enemy.
there is this idea that only ichigo group is still safe from Aizen shikai so its likely that they will fight him, maybe alone they cant win but together they might give ichigo an opening, for this she dont need a bankai.

[Annie]

Blah, if that's what you insist, then I don't see the point of continue debating.

They are lead but they won't fight? What a logic here...

Ichigo powered up and yet it's not really effective enough on NNoi. Does that stop him from getting any more fight?

Don't bother answer, you already know what you think of Rukia and her role in Bleach. We got it, she won't gte bankai because she doesn't have to fight anyone.

[Shdo]

as for ichigo, he wasnt healed when he fought noitra, if he was healed then things might have looked diffrent.


and i have the right to reply as much as i want, this is a Will Rukia learn Bankai? thread and there is also teh option of NO.

[TheLostProphecy]

Rukia won't get bankai because she isn't able to... simple like that...

Rukia f*ing kicks ass but she's weak, be used to that u.u

Her fight against Aaroniero was AWESOME, she fought someone so much stronger than her, and YET she killed him (fight is not only about power, is about strategy, Szayel Aporro was hipothetically weak, but he ruled all..)
So yes, she will fight again, she may grow, but Aizen will not wait ten years until she manages a bankai, and she's NOT an anomaly like Urahara and Ichigo to reach it in three/two days...

Bankai is not like a seventh sense in Saint Seiya, which you just REACH IT if you wish really hard...

Bleach is not very used to unconsistencies in its story, if it keeps to this line you can die waiting for her to manage bankai ^^

[penguin]

i think so, but im not sure if the series will be long enough to show her bankai
if she doesnt then its still ok, she's already awesome as she is right now :laugh

[Awergdaw Dawver]

hard gay forums?? haha

umm, imo, i dunt really think rukia can learn bankai at all... i think she is a more kidou - based shinigami than a combat orientated one..

if she ever learns bankai, i would only imagine it kidou based.

[rvngu]

can't believe so many people voted yes. here's byakuya speech on bankai:

''it's the highest level a shinigami can obtain. the ultimate technique for a soul slayer. the 4 noble families are born with reiatsu higher than others, only 1 in several generations will be able to reach that level. those who achieved it are eternally carved in SS history without exception.''

so no rukia will not achieve bankai unless bleach runs for another 100 years

[EX|pada #0]

''it's the highest level a shinigami can obtain. the ultimate technique for a soul slayer. the 4 noble families are born with reiatsu higher than others, only 1 in several generations will be able to reach that level. those who achieved it are eternally carved in SS history without exception.''

Yeah, then Ichigo achieved in only 3 dias... Renji and Ikkaku just suddenly poped-up with bankai...

[Shdo]

renji and ikkaku were cheap, making rukia getting bankai as well will be even cheaper.

ichigo is a really rare case, no1 had that growth rate, not even hitsugaya the 'prodigy' not to mention he tried a method which almost killed him, she wont survive that method.

[ch1mera]

urahara also achieved bankai in 3 days, too... but both of them (ichigo/urahara) are, just like you said @Shdo, rare cases..

[Shdo]

not to mention that the method require fighting something much stronger then you with NO shikai powers.
i doubt rukia have the swordmanship to handle such a thing.

[Undying]

Will Rukia learn Bankai? Logically or story/fan-wise?

Logically, no. Forty years of training, and she is only shikai level. Renji, after 40 years, got bankai. this already shows the difference in their talents and the hardship of getting bankai. So for Rukia, it shouldn't be possible to achieve bankai during the story.

Maybe, if we have a spin-off series a hundred years into the future, Rukia will have bankai, since she will have had enough time training and learning the insides of her sword.

Fan/story wise? With the current line-up of superpowered characters appearing, and with Kubo's refusal to let characters die, Rukia will learn bankai just to survive, since otherwise she should die, due to the sheer power differences between her and virtually every opponent of the current bad guys.

Personally, I think she won't, and she shouldn't. Whatever role of cheerleaders/growth catalyst she has to play, she can do it without having the throw Bleach's bankai rules upside down. Zaraki having the same amount of power without having one and a bazillion people having it is enough to make people go @@.

We don't need Super Saiyan's here, I'd say.

[Syn]

The cheerleader role? Rukia's role in the story isn't finished, by far. And many are awaiting her bankai; as to why she hasn't got it yet, I'd say that the mere fact of her not training to reach it like Renji did (Renji's goal was to defeat Byakuya, she hadn't had such a goal).

Rukia showed more prowess than Renji in the fighting department: 3 dances VS 1 shikai and 1 bankai moves, several high level kidou spells that Renji certainly can't pull off and she *did* kill an Espada, unlike a certain red hair guy :rolleyes:

[Miyona]

That doesnt mean she is stronger then him >_>, shes not even close to anyone else from the rescue group when talking about power.

Her beating the espada had nothing to do with her strength.

so...she would have long ways to go to get Bankai...

[Syn]

High level kidou is not only useful, it's also as strong as bankai, as it can take off captains easily. Sure, she's not there yet but she double chanted two spells at once and even Aaro mentioned that Byakuya himself, who's a master at kidou, should be proud of his sister.

[Undying]

The cheerleader role? Rukia's role in the story isn't finished, by far.
I'll leave that debate to another day, but honestly. She's useless as a fighter. No fighting means cheerleading :).
And many are awaiting her bankai; as to why she hasn't got it yet, I'd say that the mere fact of her not training to reach it like Renji did (Renji's goal was to defeat Byakuya, she hadn't had such a goal).
And therefore, as I stated, she should not be able to gain it for some time yet, hence not during the current story.

Rukia showed more prowess than Renji in the fighting department: 3 dances VS 1 shikai and 1 bankai moves, several high level kidou spells that Renji certainly can't pull off and she *did* kill an Espada, unlike a certain red hair guy :rolleyes:
High level Kido is useless if your opponent is faster than you :). And as for killing an Espada... killing some joke jarhead? Please... that's fanboy talk ;). Like, Hitsugaya can obviously kill the Primera, don'cha think? :headscratch
High level kidou is not only useful, it's also as strong as bankai, as it can take off captains easily. Sure, she's not there yet but she double chanted two spells at once and even Aaro mentioned that Byakuya himself, who's a master at kidou, should be proud of his sister.
And how does that grant her the ability to achieve bankai, pray tell? Aye, she trained to be a high-level Kido user, but I highly doubt that training Kido has anything to do with achieving bankai. On the contrary; training for one thing reduces the ability to gain another.

And therefore, as I clearly said:
Logically, no. Forty years of training, and she is only shikai level. Renji, after 40 years, got bankai. this already shows the difference in their talents and the hardship of getting bankai. So for Rukia, it shouldn't be possible to achieve bankai during the story.

Maybe, if we have a spin-off series a hundred years into the future, Rukia will have bankai, since she will have had enough time training and learning the insides of her sword.

Notice that I imply that over time, she may be able to achieve it. Just not in the near future, therefore removing the question from the present. It would take another few years at least as she still needs to train her sword rather than focusing on Kido.

[EX|pada #0]

Pointless discuss these things. Everyone knows that Rukia, as a major character, will fight in the future. And what is her probably next upgrade? Of course, bankai. Since her doesn't stand a chance against the actual enemies with only shikai. So I think is end of discussion. Saving that, she's skilled in kidou. That is, if she don't achieve bankai, at worst she'll be able to execute kidous 80+.

However, if she will be able to fight til the end with only shikai, I'll be even more proud. Since some characters needs bankai even to kill insects.

Anyway, I don't think Rukia will achieve bankai, I think she ALREADY HAVE bankai.

[Shdo]

on renji defence against syn accusations, he actually got more moves overall and more flexsibility in his attacks, while she have 3 dances with one being pretty weak unless the enemy shove your broken sword into his own face (idiot) the other two are either 'ice beam' or ice piller, it got pretty much few possiabilities.

renji on the other hand got 2 abilities with his shikai but he can use the regular attack in various ways and angles, for example how he tied himself and zayel.
his bankai add the bamboo cannon and you might say that his new energy connection between the blades give him even more possiable attacks but sadly we didnt saw him use his bankai since he trained with chad (thanks to zayel)


its amaze me how far people will go for the characters they love, regardless of logic or actuall plot continusty.

[EX|pada #0]

Shdo, please tell me, when Kubo showed us the day-by-day of Rukia into Gotei 13? Who can proof she wasn't training bankai until now?


renji on the other hand got 2 abilities with his shikai but he can use the regular attack in various ways and angles, for example how he tied himself and zayel.

Swing a sword around is now a special technique? :headscratch

[Undying]

Shdo, please tell me, when Kubo showed us the day-by-day of Rukia into Gotei 13? Who can proof she wasn't training bankai until now?

Herein lies a false part in your own argument.

Can Rukia train repeatedly for bankai and master high level Kido? I think not, considering her high level Kido required chants, which indicates lack of mastery.

There's no question of her training for bankai by learning her sword; her Kaien flashbacks are proof enough. The question is, which is emphasized more. And from what she demonstrated so far, the Kido aspect of her training is most likely the most emphasized on, therefore making her lack in other areas. At least, that's what logic would dictate.
Swing a sword around is now a special technique?
:headscratch Errr... it is. Just check out Ichigo :3.

But seriously, Renji's attack is way more flexible than straight ice-beams.

[Shdo]

she said her sword skills sucks, and she had plenty of chances to use it but she didnt even when she knew that the enemy are uber and can beat ichigobankaivaisard and what not.

i really dont accept the excuses people give about why she didnt used bankai till now, either she is stupid or she dont have bankai.

[EX|pada #0]

Can Rukia train repeatedly for bankai and master high level Kido? I think not, considering her high level Kido required chants, which indicates lack of mastery.

Why not? Captains like Byakuya do the same, or not? I'm not comparing Rukia to a captain, but if him can train kido and sword, why her can't do the same? Is just a training.

There's no question of her training for bankai by learning her sword; her Kaien flashbacks are proof enough. The question is, which is emphasized more. And from what she demonstrated so far, the Kido aspect of her training is most likely the most emphasized on, therefore making her lack in other areas. At least, that's what logic would dictate.

Kaien died just after Rukia became shinigami. And in Bleach timeline, Rukia is a shinigami for more or less 40 years. I think is time enough to achieve bankai.

she said her sword skills sucks, and she had plenty of chances to use it but she didnt even when she knew that the enemy are uber and can beat ichigobankaivaisard and what not.

She said that her sword skills sucked in the very beginning, just after she joined the shinigami academy. This kind of thing can change with time. And when she had a chance to use bankai? Against Aaro? When she finally decided to fight seriously, her sword was broken, and none shinigami can use bankai with a broken sword.

i really dont accept the excuses people give about why she didnt used bankai till now, either she is stupid or she dont have bankai.

Ok then, is your opinion.

[Shdo]

because they are captains, they were shinigamis for centuries and actually showed skill with their sword while she actually said she is weak with her sword, she is way too much specilise on kido for her level and to add bankai to that is pretty much illogical.


if she will bring a high kido in a fight i wouldnt be suprised but if she will bring a bankai or outclass some1 with swordplay then ill feel cheated.

[Undying]

Why not? Captains like Byakuya do the same, or not? I'm not comparing Rukia to a captain, bu if him can train kido and sword, why her can't do the same? Is just a training.
Yes, but captains like Byakuya also trained longer. As I said, it will take time, which in the current storyline doesn't make any sense. The final battle is joined, so to speak. If she suddenly whips out bankai it would be utterly strange.

Kaien died just after Rukia became shinigami. And in Bleach lifetime, Rukia is a shinigami for more or less 40 years. I think is time enough to achieve bankai.
It is enough time to gain bankai if one focuses on learning it (see Renji). However, Rukia's style and statements clearly indicate she's more Kido oriented, therefore meaning she would most likely have lesser skill with sword simply due to her focus in training - an expert in math wouldn't be quite so good in Biology, since they focused on math more, aye? Doesn't mean that they cannot learn biology, merely means that they will take more time. As I repeatedly state - it will take time for Rukia to gain bankai, which wouldn't make any sense in a logical way of thinking. But in Kubo's mind, I'm certain he found a plausible explanation and Rukia would indeed whip a bankai. She can't win otherwise and he'll put her in another fight for certain.

And just for the record, Kaien didn't die just after Rukia became a shinigami, they had time to train together and fight together. Also, I believe she says (or was it Aaroniero?) that she learned her dances with Kaien.

[EX|pada #0]

because they are captains, they were shinigamis for centuries and actually showed skill with their sword while she actually said she is weak with her sword, she is way too much specilise on kido for her level and to add bankai to that is pretty much illogical.

I don't think is illogical, since her controls your zanpakutou very well. If I'm not wrong, bankai is a result of mastering your zanpakutou skills, right? I mean, in shikai the shinigamis borrow the zanpakutous powers, and in bankai they definitelly control them. So... if Rukia already have 3 dances, I think she's pretty close to achieve (if she don't already have) bankai.


if she will bring a high kido in a fight i wouldnt be suprised but if she will bring a bankai or outclass some1 with swordplay then ill feel cheated.

Ok, it's what you think again.

Yes, but captains like Byakuya also trained longer. As I said, it will take time, which in the current storyline doesn't make any sense. The final battle is joined, so to speak.

Like I said before, who can proof that Rukia wasn't training bankai since a time ago?

It is enough time to gain bankai if one focuses on learning it (see Renji). However, Rukia's style and statements clearly indicate she's more Kido oriented, therefore meaning she would most likely have lesser skill with sword simply due to her focus in training - an expert in math wouldn't be quite so good in Biology, since they focused on math more, aye? Doesn't mean that they cannot learn biology, merely means that they will take more time. As I repeatedly state - it will take time for Rukia to gain bankai, which wouldn't make any sense in a logical way of thinking. But in Kubo's mind, I'm certain he found a plausible explanation and Rukia would indeed whip a bankai. She can't win otherwise and he'll put her in another fight for certain.

Look to my first answer.


And just for the record, Kaien didn't die just after Rukia became a shinigami, they had time to train together and fight together. Also, I believe she says (or was it Aaroniero?) that she learned her dances with Kaien.

Yes, only Tsuki Shiro e Hakuren. And by the flashbacks timeline, he actually died just after Rukia became a shinigami. Maybe one year after, or something close to this.

[Shdo]

she had a chance to use bankai vs grimmjow in his second fight, where she already knew she is no match for him since he IMPALED her on his hand the last time they met, she also felt the amount of reitsu he and ichigo spilled all over so she knows this is serious.


in aaro fight she also had a chance, at the start she was sure its somekind of trick and she fought with the will to kill
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcCHLvmVsy8
she thought he is desicrating kaien memory and you could see in her face that she was pissed at him, she was serious but she didnt used bankai.




as for proof that she didnt trained bankai, she said that she never was good with her sword, as of now the only way we know of getting bankai is to make the spirit submit to you, i doubt frail little rukia can make a zanpaktou spirit yield.


when did they said that he died a year after she became shinigami?

[EX|pada #0]

she had a chance to use bankai vs grimmjow in his second fight, where she already knew she is no match for him since he IMPALED her on his hand the last time they met, she also felt the amount of reitsu he and ichigo spilled all over so she knows this is serious.

:headscratch
She just wanted do freeze Grimmjow to save Ichigo.
in aaro fight she also had a chance, at the start she was sure its somekind of trick and she fought with the will to kill
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcCHLvmVsy8
she thought he is desicrating kaien memory and you could see in her face that she was pissed at him, she was serious but she didnt used bankai.

Just after Aaro shows your truly face, she says that she was controling her powers from the beginning, so...


as for proof that she didnt trained bankai, she said that she never was good with her sword, as of now the only way we know of getting bankai is to make the spirit submit to you, i doubt frail little rukia can make a zanpaktou spirit yield.

Sword combat skills has nothing to do with bankai exactly. A bankai is achieved when the level of synchronization between the zanpakutou spirit and the owner are in the ultimate state. And a think her three dances is a proof of this synchronization.


when did they said that he died a year after she became shinigami?

Just look at the flashbacks. Do you think Kaien and Rukia spent more than one year training together?

[Shdo]

could anyone make a flashback of 10 years and make anything logical from it? it could be a year and it could be 30 years.

as for your first claim, i still dont see why she tried to beat him in such a sorry attempt, i think she simply couldnt do any better.


i didnt understood the second point.


as for bankai, its not achived by sword or by sync but by making the spirit submit to you. and she is too weak to beat something like that without her shikai (its seems that you cant use shikai and such in that fight)

[Undying]

Like I said before, who can proof that Rukia wasn't training bankai since a time ago?



Look to my first answer.
And I think I made it rather clear that since she mastered Kido she simply shouldn't have had enough training to gain bankai.

Yes, only Tsuki Shiro e Hakuren. And by the flashbacks timeline, he actually died just after Rukia became a shinigami. Maybe one year after, or something close to this.
That's two out of three...

[EX|pada #0]

could anyone make a flashback of 10 years and make anything logical from it? it could be a year and it could be 30 years.

Even if she trained with him for 30 years, 10 years is enough to achieve bankai >.>

as for your first claim, i still dont see why she tried to beat him in such a sorry attempt, i think she simply couldnt do any better.

Is what you think.


i didnt understood the second point.

Wich one? Sorry, my english really sucks and sometimes my posts seems confuse >.>


as for bankai, its not achived by sword or by sync but by making the spirit submit to you. and she is too weak to beat something like that without her shikai (its seems that you cant use shikai and such in that fight)

Well, to achieve bankai I think everyone beated the spirit using only shikai, right? Besides, bankai is about sync the zanpakutou spirit with the owner. I can find a page where it's saud for you (but not now, since I don't remember exactly. Anyway, I can send it by PM when i found.

About the time, Renji joined the academy in the same time as her, and he have bankai. Why she can't have too?

And I think I made it rather clear that since she mastered Kido she simply shouldn't have had enough training to gain bankai.

Damn, why not? >.> I can't understand why a shinigami can't train zanpakutou and kidou at the same time. Are you saying that all shinigamis are or like Zaraki (sword mastered) or like Aizen (kidou mastered)? It's nonsense, there's a lot of balanced shinigamis around.


That's two out of three...

So...?

[Aizen Sousuke]

I think she is capable of learning Bankai.. or rather, has the potential to. However, she still has to develop her skills in basic combat and become a better Shinigami at the Shikai level. While Bankai is certainly in her realm, It would take her a long time to complete the necessary training - 10 years - to achieve it, especially at this point. Sure, you could argue that she could use the Urahara method, but I think that would ruin the technique if everyone began using it. It should remain being used by only Urahara and Ichigo.

[Shdo]

the problem in the urahara method is that it force you to fight something that might be beyond your powers at the moment, making it fatal.

beside i think that you cant use shikai in that combat, after all its about submiting the spirit of the sword, when shikai is about barrowing its power, i doubt that you can use the sword powers to submit it, the whole point is to do this with your own power.

[ch1mera]

i think she would be able to learn bankai... The reason I say that is because she is a very skilled shinigami. It's been said that the only reason she didn't become a seated officer is because Byakuya made sure that wouldn't happen...to keep her out of harms way. Rukia also did great in her encounter with the arrancar from GJ squad and almost got GJ the second time she fought him...but she got distracted and let her gaurd down..
I do think she's probably stronger than she's been given credit for.. I do think she will eventually obtain Bankai as being the female&fighter lead. Chad had his hollow like powers. inoue turned to have godlike powers. We saw Ishida with such power. As being the part of the main cast and the most probable way for a shinigami to be stronger, she will reach Bankai. i think...

[EX|pada #0]

the problem in the urahara method is that it force you to fight something that might be beyond your powers at the moment, making it fatal.

I'm not talking about the Urahara method :p

Rukia don't deserves bankai using this "cheat" way. She deserves better.

[Shdo]

she cant reach better.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bankai#Bankai

as you can see, to reach banaki you need to subjucate the spirit.
urahara method is only to force the meterialisation, even if she do that on her own she will still need to beat her spirit and without using shikai, meaning she will be in deep shit because she suck in swordplay.


sleepy now.


keep in mind that the two who reached bankai on their own, ikkaku and renji, are both exelent swordmen and helped one another in their training.

[EX|pada #0]

Damn, where is said that she can't materialize the Sode no Shirayuki? >.>
Is like a say, the people judge the Rukia's power, but they forget her never got a chance to show all her can do.

Plus about the real world thing, if you read the Ju-Ni translation for chapter 0-B, you'll see that Rukia was already sent to the real world before but misteriously she can't remember. Maybe a hint, isn't?

EDIT: And you know how much skilled Sode no Shirayuki is to say Rukia isn't able to beat him/her?

[Shdo]

even if she could meterialize it she cannot beat it with her sword skill, you cant even use shikai against it, both ichigo,renji and ikkaku were exelent swordmen, she isnt, how will she subjucate it? chanting? by the time she will be half way that avatar will freeze her, you seen its attacks what chance does she have against the source of that power with no sword skill or shikai powers?


"Plus about the real world thing, if you read the Ju-Ni translation for chapter 0-B, you'll see that Rukia was already sent to the real world before but misteriously she can't remember. Maybe a hint, isn't?"

i dont understand to what this is related.

[rvngu]

That doesnt mean she is stronger then him >_>, shes not even close to anyone else from the rescue group when talking about power.

Her beating the espada had nothing to do with her strength.

so...she would have long ways to go to get Bankai...

yeah her opponent (number 9) was supposed to be really strong but ended up just being stupid. she should have been killed easily.

[EX|pada #0]

Read the "EDIT" at my previous post

"Plus about the real world thing, if you read the Ju-Ni translation for chapter 0-B, you'll see that Rukia was already sent to the real world before but misteriously she can't remember. Maybe a hint, isn't?"

i dont understand to what this is related.

Is related to the fact that to achieve bankai a shinigami have do materialize his zanpakutou in the real world.


yeah her opponent (number 9) was supposed to be really strong but ended up just being stupid. she should have been killed easily.

Then tell me when Rukia took a direct hit in that fight? (before she gets impalled because she said that she don't have the nerve enough to hurt Kaien's body, as you can see here http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/267/17/ )

[Shdo]

it dont mean in the REAL REAL world, but to meterialize it in a way that others can see it, to the point when you are not seeing things and hear a monkey speaking to you.
for example renji meterialised zabimaru twice, one time alone and the second time ichigo could see it, so he was ready to have his fight to subjucate it.


rukia cannot beat something that is the source of her power with her sword skill, but in the end as long as we didnt even saw her zanpakutou spirit there is no point in even thinking she can beat it.
also when you say that if renji could reach bankai then she can as well then you forget 2 things, he was in the acadamy longer, he was in the advance class, she was removed from the academy when she entered the kuchiki clan, she didnt even finished her training and when they did train in the academy he was considered more tallented then her.

the second thing is that he had a teacher, a wonderfull teacher for beating a bankai with your own strength, and that is ikkaku, and even then it took years of training for that tallented student, years with a good trainer and even then he reached bankai only recently.


rukia on the other hand said that she wasnt really good at the academy, she was in a normal class, her only strong point was kido which still was avrage when compared to normal shinigami's, she never was any good with her sword. when she graduated it was before she even finished her first year (i think) because of the kuchiki clan, she didnt had anyone to train her for bankai especially after kaien death. and even if she could meterialise her shikai she still need to beat it somehow, and by looking at her winning strikes i doubt it, she simply dont have enough offensive power.

[EX|pada #0]

it dont mean in the REAL REAL world, but to meterialize it in a way that others can see it, to the point when you are not seeing things and hear a monkey speaking to you.
for example renji meterialised zabimaru twice, one time alone and the second time ichigo could see it, so he was ready to have his fight to subjucate it.

Ok then, but in the Wikipedia is typed "Real world", so.. lol Anyway, it actually don't change the things.


rukia cannot beat something that is the source of her power with her sword skill, but in the end as long as we didnt even saw her zanpakutou spirit there is no point in even thinking she can beat it.

I think the contrary. There's no point in thinking she'll be defeated by a spirit that we even know. So, is right to THINK she can beat the Sode no Shirayuki. After all, none can proof the contrary, since whe don't know her zanpakutou's spirit and mainly it powers.


also when you say that if renji could reach bankai then she can as well then you forget 2 things, he was in the acadamy longer, he was in the advance class, she was removed from the academy when she entered the kuchiki clan, she didnt even finished her training and when they did train in the academy he was considered more tallented then her.

I don't think the train in the academy is harder than the train in the Gotei 13.

the second thing is that he had a teacher, a wonderfull teacher for beating a bankai with your own strength, and that is ikkaku, and even then it took years of training for that tallented student, years with a good trainer and even then he reached bankai only recently.

Well, bankai has nothing to to with teachers. Is a matter of zanpakutou and the user. If he haved a teacher is ok, but it don't means anything at all. Anything like "to achieve bankai, you need a teacher"


rukia on the other hand said that she wasnt really good at the academy, she was in a normal class, her only strong point was kido which still was avrage when compared to normal shinigami's, she never was any good with her sword. when she graduated it was before she even finished her first year (i think) because of the kuchiki clan, she didnt had anyone to train her for bankai especially after kaien death. and even if she could meterialise her shikai she still need to beat it somehow, and by looking at her winning strikes i doubt it, she simply dont have enough offensive power.

It was in the very beginning. And, saying again, bankai has nothing to do with teachers. And again, you don't know the Sode no Shirayuki powers to say "Rukia will lose to her" >.>

[Shdo]

the point was that she was a weak student to begin with and even a tallented student like renji needed help. she didnt got any help, so...


sleep now.

[EX|pada #0]

Yeah, tallented student, but you're forgeting since the very beginning, Rukia has more reiatsu than Renji. And she was a "week student" in the academy, after you join Gotei 13, you're forced to get strong. Remember, FROM THE VERY BEGINNING, Rukia wasn't a vice-captain because Byakuya have interfered.

And the fact that Renji needed a teacher don't means anything. Like I said before, bankai is a matter of a zanpakutou and its user. And Rukia control her Sode no Shirayuki very well, three dances already! Isn't everyday you see a shinigami with that control over his zanpakutou.

And the "sleep now" is for me? Nah, is only 09:40PM here in Brazil :p isn't time to sleep yet.

[H!Mandy]

I really think Rukia has the ability to achieve Bankai.
she has some awesome powers so far, the most beautiful zanpakutou, so i don't know if KT-sama is going to do it, but I voted 'yes'. I'd really like to see it, it wouldn't be a big surprise.

Byakuya is the only one who makes us think that Bankai is really flippin rare with that speech he made to Ichi. but hey, Ichigo's got one real quick, and he's only half shinigami and had barely learned how to do the job
Renji's got one, and he has at least worst reiatsu controlling abilities than Rukia in their childhood. true, he was in the first class, but that doesn't mean much: so were Kira and Hinamori, do they have more chance to achieve Bankai than Rukia? =p

'sides, Rukia trained with the fukutaichou of her division. she is special. she could be at least fukutaichou level by now, only nii-sama won't let that happen. she defeated the 9th Espada, even with all the emotional stuff involved. if Niero didn't have Kaien's body, she'd have won much quicker (Niero said so himself: 'why did she aim the kidou for the wall? she'd have hit me point-blank with it since I cant move now' or smth, remember?)

so yeah, Rukia is strong. and one of the main characters.
power up for her would be awesome, not odd at all.

[Miyona]

Rukia's importance wont be lowered if she doesnt get Bankai. She can contribute in ways that dont have to do with fighting. In other words she doesnt need it to be important.

Just a comment...

[H!Mandy]

I agree with you Miyona =D
of all Bleach characters, there are many more that need to have their powers shown/developed

but the thread is about Rukia's Bankai, and I think it's damm possible. she's just too modest saying that her powers were 'average'

she is Bya's sister. :hm
need I say more?

[myfinalheaven]

Oh gosh I really hope she doesn't only for the pure fact that Bankai, originally a skill learned by only the very best of the best shinigami would be cheapened. It is something that is extremely difficult to get and I think it should stay that way, there should be characters that should not be able to obtain it as such. Although it was said that Rukia is an extremely competent shinigami, and should have been seated I do not believe she should obtain bankai. Also I think as of now it is out of her reach.

although I would prefer if she doesn't

QFT. I hope Kubo does not sell out on this one I really do.

[EX|pada #0]

In truth, I don't want Rukia to have bankai. Would be awesome if she fights the strong enemies from now on using only shikai, but I'm only saying here that's pretty possible for her to achieve bankai, if she already didn't achieved it.

EDIT:

Also I think as of now it is out of her reach.

Really, is totally out of the second main character's reach to achieve an awesoooome thing like bankai.

[myfinalheaven]

Would be awesome if she fights the strong enemies from now on using only shikai,

Yeah I agree but I also disagree, I think it is necessary for bleach to be kept in perspective, when a character is outmatched they are outmatched. Rukia took on a Gillian class and barely survived only through her own resolve, intelligence and taking advantage of an opportune moment. However, it was a double KO, and puts the power levels in perspective. It should continue to play out in this way.

[Miyona]

Really, is totally out of the second main character's reach to achieve an awesoooome thing like bankai.

Her being the 2nd main character doesnt matter >_> its not like she is destined to have it cause shes a main character.

she can fill her role as a main character without having it.

[myfinalheaven]

Her being the 2nd main character doesnt matter >_> its not like she is destined to have it cause shes a main character.

Exactly!!! And like I said in my previous post this all has to be kept in perspective of character strength or else the manga will be reduced to a farce.

[H!Mandy]

I still think that Rukia's fights weren't enough for us to see her real power.
Rukia vs Niero had a lot of emotional side involved, and that's the only reason why Rukia let him stab her. she said: 'Kaien-dono, I don't have he strenght to fight you', meaning she didn't want to kill him again. later she remembered where his heart truly lied and stabbed and killed the 9th Espada even being so badly hurt.

D Roy...I'm not even gonna comment on that one.

I just think that, as much as bankais is somewhat rare (all the Captains that ever existed except Kenpachi had one, plus the exceptions such as Renji, Ichigo and Ikkaku) it would be perfectly normal if KT decided to show us that Rukia can have a Bankai. she has loads of importance in other aspect too, but this would be nice. KT loves her.

about needing someone to teach bankai, we only learned that Ikkaku teach Renji much later on. and the fact that we haven't seen Shirayuki's spirit doesn't mean it hasn't materialized (we haven't seen any of the captain's zanpakutou's spirits...)

so yeah, it's possible but not necessary, let's wait and see.

[EX|pada #0]

Her being the 2nd main character doesnt matter >_> its not like she is destined to have it cause shes a main character.

she can fill her role as a main character without having it.

Agree with your second afirmation, but obviously the fact of Rukia are the second main character matter. Do you've noticed the main characters are the ones who most have power-ups?

And don't think if she achieve bankai only for this will be a farse. Look to Ichigo. All his victories are farses then? Oh, so Bleach is a farse at all! :eek:

@Mandy - "it's possible but not necessary" - is EXACTLY what I think.

[myfinalheaven]

I still think that Rukia's fights weren't enough for us to see her real power.
Rukia vs Niero had a lot of emotional side involved, and that's the only reason why Rukia let him stab her. she said: 'Kaien-dono, I don't have he strenght to fight you', meaning she didn't want to kill him again. later she remembered where his heart truly lied and stabbed and killed the 9th Espada even being so badly hurt.

/Sigh...she was outclassed. She did have the resolve to fight she even says so herself, she is there for her friends. She was at her full potential and outclassed, remember this was an Espada and Grimmjow handled her fairly easily in the real world, before turning to Ichigo. Yes she had grown from then, but I still think she was no match for the Espada. As Urahara said a strong will is greater than steel and I think this is what allowed her to be victorious over the Espada, much like Ichigo was able to be victorious over his foes in the SS arc. She was determined to save her friend and determined to preserve Kaien's honour. This gave her the drive to succeed. That being said, her main character arc is resolved and I think she will take a more supporting role over anything else. Bankai for Rukia, despite her being a main character would be silly.

KT loves her.

Shouldnt make a difference really, KT needs to keep some logic to this story and not allow it to spin out of control..

And don't think if she achieve bankai only for this will be a farse. Look to Ichigo. All his victories are farses then? Oh, so Bleach is a farse at all!

Again sigh...Ichigo achieving Bankai was never a farce since the beginning of Bleach it has been highlighted that Ichigo is unique in his abilites. This has remained throughout the manga, he has an immense reitsu and is unique in his ability to acquire skills and power.

[EX|pada #0]

Are you saying that Rukia and Grimmjow, in fact, FIGHTED? He attacked her when she was looking to Ichigo in both cases!

[myfinalheaven]

No I am not but he still was able to easily free himself from her attack

The 9th outmatched her, simple fact, his power levels were greater however that is not to say she is not an intelligent fighter and that is the aspect I love about Rukia, she is an intelligent fighter.

[EX|pada #0]

"No I am not but he still was able to easily free himself from her attack"

C'mon, was just a shikai attack in a 6th Espada... what did you wanted?

[H!Mandy]

Rukia is important, Rukia is strong.
Rukia is intelligent.
she is not the princess in danger anymore, but I don't think she'll take over 'the supportive role'
I never said that Rukia will have Bankai just because KT loves her. the fact is that he won't ignore her, there is still story about her
or do you think mystery-man smartass Urahara chose her to put the bloody Hougyoku inside because she was pretty?

I don't even think the question was
'Can poor little Rukia achieve Bankai or is she just mediocre as she used to think?'
but :
'Will Rukia achieve Bankai?'
is KT going to make it happen? does Rukia have a reason for training harder? did she found what she needs to protect? what kind of training would she have to go trhough/how long would it take' etc

more than 70% of the people answered 'yes'. it is not totally out of question unless KT says it is.

Rukia couldn't defeat Grimm, fact.
but she killed the 9th Espada with one stab in the end and survived
she won
she is stronger than Yammy too, let's use the logic
therefore, she is stronger than 2 Espada. out of 10. whoa.
Ichigo isn't a match for the 4th one yet and he's the one with the awesome skills. omg Rukia is so weak.

my opinion now, you can disconsider this if you want:

being the 2nd main character means she will have lots of scenes, she can't be fighting with the same powers forever, that's not how Bleach works. maybe she won't develop Bankai for the Winter War, maybe she won't n the whole story of Bleach, but she could.
from the chapter when she finally shows us her beautiful zanpakutou, she used 2 dances, then the third one was revealed at the end of her fight with Niero.
if she had killed him with a plain normal stab of her broken sword or one of her 2 first dances, it wouldn't have been fun
and she isn't going to stand and see her friends get killed in the WW. she is going to do something, fight, and somehow get stronger, that's what I think.
if it adds to the story, it can happen

[mitzibe]

did i post here before? :confused: i can't remember but ima say it one more time.

OK rukia is strong. rukia is all sugar and spice and everything nice and positive and green lines and 4 digit percentages. but you know what? rukia probably won't ever reach soi fon's level.

no bankai for rukia. :yay

[EX|pada #0]

LOL, mitzibe, funny post XD

[Aizen Sousuke]

No I am not but he still was able to easily free himself from her attack

The 9th outmatched her, simple fact, his power levels were greater however that is not to say she is not an intelligent fighter and that is the aspect I love about Rukia, she is an intelligent fighter.

Exactly.. Rukia knew she was outclassed, so she tried to use whatever she could to win.. the sunlight.. combining kidou techniques, etc.

Rukia is very strategic, and it will take her a long way, however, in terms of achieving Bankai, being intelligent won't make up for lack of strength. She would probably be able to get her Zanpakutou to materialize quicker then others, as she would be calm and diligent, but mastering Bankai would take her a while, as she admits herself, she is not the best at fighting.

[EX|pada #0]

But like I said thousand times here today, we don't know the power of Sode no Shirayuki to know if Rukia will/would/was able to beat her or not.

And I'm sorry, but like the Rukia herself said, she held her powers during the whole fight against Aaroniero. When she finally decided to fight, she was already impalled, and then she used shirafune. Re-read the fight, and then pay attention to her words again. Well, read at least the following pages

http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/267/04/
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/267/05/
http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/267/17/

[H!Mandy]

whoa mitzibe, are ou that much of a Soi Fon fan? xD

Rukia + bankai doesn't mean she will over power all captains ya know ^^

Sousuke: precisely =D
Rukia would work hard if she had to. she knows her limits and all, and it appears to me that she has a very good relationship with SHirayuki, I can't imagine it being otherwise. Rukia doesn't fight merely for the sake of it, but once she needs to get stronger, she will ^^

[Jasse]

Well.

I can understand the arguments that believe Rukia is not worth of attaining the Bankai stage quite yet..(as in she needs more years) and I respect it.

But,

Rukia is the 1st lead female characters and her importance in the plot will require her to fight significantly stronger enemies,but there is also the reason that she hates being under Ichigo's protection umbrella, signals that she can only advance,hence why I wont be surprised if she gets bankai at some point in the series.

Ichigo is not the only character in bleach that gets preferential treatment from the mangaka. Kubo loves Rukia quite alot, she was the only one besides Ichigo to have successfully defeat an Espada while Ishida/Renji/Chad all failed one way or another and were humiliated along the way as well.
You might want to undermine Aaron and saying he is not a big deal. but still the fact that ONLY she and Ichigo had wins in HM arc(assuming HM arc is nearly finished and Chad does not get to fight another one) is a deal.
I am trying to look at it from Kubo pov.

The preferential treatment that Rukia gets is only 2nd to ichigo. Thats what i see.

Besides, I won't get very attached to the rules Kubo put, seeing as Kubo himself is not attached to them as strongly. He will change the power-levels as he deems necessary and convenient to what the plot and the events require. I am no longer caught up by them.

I am sorry, I did not participate or added any manga panels. I didn't tackle the issue "technically". I am speaking purely what i feel regarding the subject, my hunch if you may say.

[tifa]

Of course she'll learn Bankai, though it may take a while before we'll see it. I think Kubo will 'surprise' us(or me at least) again with Rukia's powers. Because of the SS arc, I never thought that Rukia had such a powerful shikai. And her three dances still amaze me. They were all shown all of the sudden, never showing that Rukia had obtained those attacks.

[Aizen Sousuke]

Even if Rukia gets Bankai, it will still keep her ability to fight opponents very limited, as her specialty is in kidou. You also have to consider the strength of some of the younger Bankai's, such as Renji and Hitsugaya. Rukia gaining Bankai will only put her on par with these individuals, and no where close to Ichigo's level.

[EX|pada #0]

And if her bankai is a something like a "magic" based attack, as tsuki shiro and hakuren, for example? Not all bankais are based in "phisically" attacks.

Sorry to argue against you, Aizen-sama >_<

[Aizen Sousuke]

Well, I would assume the strength of one's Bankai correlates with the amount of reiatsu one has? I don't recall having to be able to have tons of reiatsu for kidou incantations, you just have to be adept at the art. Rukia can be good at kidou, but be a weaker (but highly intelligent) fighter. That's sort of what I meant earlier, that she is good with kidou incantation but is generally weaker in terms of reiatsu, thus keeping her at a level of around Hitsugaya/Renji if she obtains Bankai.

[Shapeshifter]

If Rukia ever gets Bankai, it will be a long way off, but personally i doubt she will >.> She has always been only average at everthing she does. Bankai is for those that are above average :P

[EX|pada #0]

@Aizen - But from the very beginning she has more reiatsu than Renji >.> And we don't know how her bankai attack would be to say "she'll be at the level of Hitsugaya/Renji", we just don't know! May be something overpower - or not. We don't know.

@Shapeshifter - I don't know if a shinigami in vice-captain level who KILLED (say what you want, but she *DID*) an espada is just about average.

[Aizen Sousuke]

@Aizen - But from the very beginning she has more reiatsu than Renji >.

That is when they were kids. Renji has obviously surpassed Rukia in every aspect except Kidou and Intelligence. Byakuya said Rukia is strong enough to be a seated officer, while Renji earned Vice-Captain before he got Bankai. Seated officer does not mean Vice-Captain though. Renji has clearly excelled further than Rukia at being a Shinigami, and I would assume that means his reiatsu has developed further as well.

[EX|pada #0]

That is when they were kids. Renji has obviously surpassed Rukia in every aspect except Kidou and Intelligence. Byakuya said Rukia is strong enough to be a seated officer, while Renji earned Vice-Captain before he got Bankai. Seated officer does not mean Vice-Captain though. Renji has clearly excelled further than Rukia at being a Shinigami, and I would assume that means his reiatsu has developed further as well.

Well, if you think any "seated officer" can kill an espada, then it's ok. Otherwise, bankai has nothing to do with reiatsu, in truth. Byakuya's words to Renji "When your reiatsu reach the size of your bankai, maybe you'll get results with it", what means... yeah, you know. Furthermore, we didn't got the oportunity to see Rukia's full power yet. D-Roy was underrated, and in the fight against Aaroniero she got a lot of inconveniences.

[Aizen Sousuke]

Well, if you think any "seated officer" can kill an espada, then it's ok. Otherwise, bankai has nothing to do with reiatsu, in truth. Byakuya's words to Renji "When your reiatsu reach the size of your bankai, maybe you'll get results with it", what means... yeah, you know. Furthermore, we didn't got the oportunity to see Rukia's full power yet. D-Roy was underrated, and in the fight against Aaroniero she got a lot of inconveniences.

Byakuya was saying that Renji's Bankai is enormous, but his reiatsu sucks compared to how large his Bankai is. He was speaking using the size as a relation to strength. Basically, he meant that, even though he have Bankai, your reiatsu sucks, so the Bankai is useless

So, as a matter of fact, reiatsu has EVERYTHING to do with Bankai.

And I don't see how the fight turned around for Rukia when she confirmed that Aaroniero was not Kaien, except that she had the strength to pierce him once he has pierced her.

[Undying]

@Aizen - But from the very beginning she has more reiatsu than Renji >.>

Err... the manga scan where this was stated? I believe it's an anime only thing, and I don't accept anime as a canon source of information. From what I see Renji's reiatsu is superior to her in every single aspect. After all, he *is* a vice-captain while she's only "seated officer level".

[EX|pada #0]

Byakuya was saying that Renji's Bankai is enormous, but his reiatsu sucks compared to how large his Bankai is. He was speaking using the size as a relation to strength. Basically, he meant that, even though he have Bankai, your reiatsu sucks, so the Bankai is useless

So, as a matter of fact, reiatsu has EVERYTHING to do with Bankai.

Indeed, but what I'm saying here is reiatsu has nothing to do with the bankai itself. I mean, do you think if Renji has more reiatsu, his bankai would be different? An other kind of attack? Did you got what I'm saying now?

And I don't see how the fight turned around for Rukia when she confirmed that Aaroniero was not Kaien, except that she had the strength to pierce him once he has pierced her.

Yeah, she confirmed. But... http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/267/10/

@Undying - Look at the "The Star and the Stray Dog" chapter. I think his number is 90 and something.

[Aizen Sousuke]

Indeed, but what I'm saying here is reiatsu has nothing to do with the bankai itself. I mean, do you think if Renji has more reiatsu, his bankai would be different? An other kind of attack? Did you got what I'm saying now?

It would be stronger. Why do you think Hitsugaya sucks so much? His Bankai actually has some decent frost abilities, but he is so weak that his Bankai is a joke.

Yeah, she confirmed. But... http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/267/10/

I'm not sure what you are trying to prove. Her confirmation didn't change her performance in the battle itself. Sure, she was weakened a little, but time and time again we see that is nothing (Ichigo vs. Kenpachi, Kenpachi vs. Nnoitra, etc. etc.)

[EX|pada #0]

I don't the Hitsugaya's bankai sucks, but is not the case >.>

Will be stronger, ok, but in a different form? It will not be that giant snake?

[Aizen Sousuke]

The snake could get faster and attack in a more efficient manner, and possibly learn new techniques. And yes, a different form could be possible, but for example, I am sure Byakuya did not know Senkei off the bat. Once he developed his reiatsu and trained with his Bankai further, Senkei became available. Though I have no evidence as to whether or not Senkei was available off the bat, it makes the most sense that once you obtain your Bankai, you must train further to enhance it. Everything is done in a logical progression, going step-by-step, and the time it takes for that has not been available for Renji/Hitsugaya/Rukia.

I don't doubt Rukia has potential for Bankai, but not in the current Bleach time line.

[EX|pada #0]

And yes, a different form could be possible, but for example, I am sure Byakuya did not know Senkei off the bat. Once he developed his reiatsu and trained with his Bankai further, Senkei became available.

Senkei is, let me say, an "extra" attack, and not the bankai main attack.

it makes the most sense that once you obtain your Bankai, you must train further to enhance it.

Sure, none achieves bankai and it's automatically in your fullpower state. With Rukia it will not be different, if she in fact achieves bankai.

Everything is done in a logical progression, going step-by-step, and the time it takes for that has not been available for Renji/Hitsugaya/Rukia. I don't doubt Rukia has potential for Bankai, but not in the current Bleach time line.[

True. Renji, Hitsugaya and Rukia don't have time to enhance bankai in Bleach timeline. But I'm pretty sure that Rukia will at least achieve (if she wasn't achieved yet) it in the series. Well, is what I think.

[Undying]

@Undying - Look at the "The Star and the Stray Dog" chapter. I think his number is 90 and something.

Yup, as I thought. Renji never says anything about Rukia having more spiritual power than him. He says that she had spiritual power, which out of their group only he had, and he didn't like it.

She never had more reiatsu than he did, and reiatsu is required for bankai, as a technique of such proportions would require a large amount of energy to manifest given the devastating effects it causes on the battlefield - it is, after all, a megaweapon for the shinigami. Not to mention that Byakuya links reiatsu and bankai, stating that even amongst the nobles, only a few in several generations are born with the spiritual pressure required to achieve bankai.

In other words, from Rukia's current strength, I'm very skeptic of her getting bankai logically.

As far as the Aaoroniero fight goes - sticking your weapon into the enemy's one and only weakspot does not make you powerful. In a sense, it's the same as shooting someone in the head in the middle of a fistfight. You win, but that doesn't make you more powerful because the target has no defense against your attack.

[Aizen Sousuke]

Senkei is, let me say, an "extra" attack, and not the bankai main attack.

It is an extra attack that puts Byakuya on the offensive. Clearly, Byakuya would not have been able to have such control right off the bat. And considering that Byakuya uses the technique against opponents he really wants to kill, I wouldn't categorize Senkei as "an extra attack." It is a powerful asset, even more deadly than the Bankai's primary form.

Sure, none achieves bankai and it's automatically in your fullpower state. With Rukia it will not be different, if she in fact achieves bankai.

You must crawl before you walk. You must walk before you run. When you can run, you can only run faster from there.

[EX|pada #0]

@Undying - I'll not talk about Rukia x AA fight again. Read the pages that I've posted before. About Rukia not having more reiatsu than Renji, then tell me why she became the "spiritual leader" of the group, she's a way better than him in kidou etc?

@Aizen - Senkei is a result of the enhancement of the bankai, as you said before. And I agree with your second affirmation, even if didn't got exactly what that has to do with my statement.

[Aizen Sousuke]

Well I meant that in order to achieve the full potential of your Bankai, you must realize your own full potential and push yourself closer to your limits. I believe that Senkei is a result of Byakuya's advancement in his power as he gets ever close to the Shinigami limit. Hitsugaya is far from that point, which results in him, as well as his Bankai, being rather weak. Rukia, once learning Bankai, would still have a long ways to go until she realizes it's full potential, as well as her own (thus, running faster).

[EX|pada #0]

In this case, I completely agree with you.

[Undying]

@Undying - I'll not talk about Rukia x AA fight again. Read the pages that I've posted before.
I was merely pointing out it had nothing to do with power, while you seem to use it as proof of Rukia's great power.
About Rukia not having more reiatsu than Renji, then tell me why she became the "spiritual leader" of the group, she's a way better than him in kidou etc?

How does "spiritual leader" translate into "she has more reiatsu than Renji"? There are spiritual leaders in real life as well, which does not relate to their amount of reiatsu.

Rukia had less reiatsu than Renji, was weaker in all aspects except Kido, but, as her personality and charisma allowed her, she became the leader of their ragtag group of scullions.

[EX|pada #0]

Ok, then. If it's a question of "is not pointed in the manga" So where is said that Renji has more reiatsu than Rukia? Yes, he have bankai and all, but Rukia just fought 2 times in the whole series, and you saw what kind of fight that two was. So we can't understimate the Rukia's power at all.

[Fortunate]

Yes. It'll probably consist of more dances, and possibly a Last/Final dance. :p

[EX|pada #0]

Exactly, Fortunate. This discussion is so tiring @@ I blame my hot-head to always disc